This forum is for discussion pertaining to homebrew and indie software for the Dreamcast, such as homebrew games, emulators/interpreters, and other homebrew software/applications. Porting requests and developmental ideas are not to be made here; you can make those here. If you need any help burning discs for homebrew software, this is the place to ask as well.
Those of us following the PSP homebrew scene are probably familiar with Monkey64 but for those who aren't up to date, it's an N64 emulator for the PSP written from the ground up by PSmonkey.
Now, according to this thread, there are serious signs of progress with running commercial games on the emu! Better yet, GPF is working on porting the emulator to Dreamcast, and we can already see in the aforementioned thread, the N64 logo in a commercial ROM running on Chankast! W0000t!!!
Of course, the Dreamcast has more technical limitations than the PSP, but hopefully commercial ROMs will become playable at some point in this emulators future.
DaMadFiddler wrote:Oh man...I'm gonna get me some serious playtime in on that logo!
Well, when you consider the fact that the emulator is being built from the ground up, and that it's still in it's early stages, it's pretty impressive.
If no one can get a snes emulator to run full speed on the dreamcast without frameskip or what not's than how are they suppose to get a more powerful N64 emulator to work.
If you can get the N64 emulator to work why not a Sega Saturn emulator.
And... Where's the promised freedo emulator.
And... If this is all possible why not upgrade the mame emulator or even other more obscure SGA's...
At least with we have the NES emulation looking good...
If no one can get a snes emulator to run full speed on the dreamcast without frameskip or what not's than how are they suppose to get a more powerful N64 emulator to work.
If you can get the N64 emulator to work why not a Sega Saturn emulator.
And... Where's the promised freedo emulator.
And... If this is all possible why not upgrade the mame emulator or even other more obscure SGA's...
At least with we have the NES emulation looking good...
Some of it has to do with developer interest. Some of it has to do with hardware complexity. (For example, a Saturn is far more difficult to emulate than an N64 or even a DC, because of the way the hardware was designed, with a myriad of different processors that must all be emulated).
But I'm sure someone like BlueCrab, Atani, or Quzar could give you a far more complete answer than I.
Not only is it compelling reading, but it clarifies why things are the way they are.
For example: It would explain the complexities of each device ("N64, SNES, SATURN, NES, GENESIS, ETC...") and would contrast the diffences between those machines, the dreamcast and the comparision to PC technology.
I say... This is your homework assignment... A hundred page master thesis on the above sentence.
After that is done, please sticky it to the forum for all to read. Do not leave out the technical, that is the best part. I love talking "MIPS".
...You do realize that relatively complete technical documents are available online for all of those systems, yes? Just Google what you want, rather than expecting the DC crew to be your research monkeys
Plus, if you search the memories, I'm sure you'll find this question answered, in much more detail, several times before in regard to various systems. It's one of those "AAARGH STOP ASKING THAT!" questions.
I've already read most of the tech info on these systems.
I already relise these questions I state for a master thesis are asked again and again hence the sticky to the forum bit.
It really doesn't get to the point why someone is willing to put a lot work in a more advanced emulator (N64) when (Snes) emulator or (Saturn) emulator is known to be complicated and unable to produce the quality needed for emulation. I.e. the sound emulation for a (Genesis) system seems to be a point of contention in the ability to emulate it properly on a dreamcast. What about (Sega CD) emulation.
You see my point is why go with something more advanced when the less advanced stuff hasn't been figured out yet.
Not that I don't appreciate the emulator nor wouldn't enjoy N64 emulation on a dreamcast.
Well, don't worry too much about it, zman. Just because someone's working or porting an emulator, doesn't mean that it will actually be fullspeed or even marginally playable. I don't know much about the PSP's specs or Monkey64's author's abilities, but I doubt it'll even be playable on the PSP, a port to the DC will be that much less playable.
While there are indeed peculiarities and things about each system and each coder that make "if the Dreamcast can emulate system Y, why can't it emulate system X" the wrong question, it's true that if the Dreamcast could emulate the N64 playably it could also do the SNES, GBA, more advanced arcade architectures or 3DO (Saturn is a whole other can of worms), but since we won't be seeing a playable N64 emulator we can't assume anything else either.
In any case, the Dreamcast *CAN* emulate the SNES, the 3DO even the GBA fullspeed, but there's just no coders working on the Dreamcast with the right mix of free time, skill and dedication to get it done. I suspect that even the N64 could be done, but would take more than anyone around here has to give.
zman wrote:If no one can get a snes emulator to run full speed on the dreamcast without frameskip or what not's than how are they suppose to get a more powerful N64 emulator to work.
Getting it to work at all isn't really a problem. Getting it to work well is a problem.
There are also a number of short cuts you can take with more advanced systems. I remember UltraHLE running as about as well as ZSNES on my machine back in '99 or so. UltraHLE worked by ignoring large chunks of the hardware, and replacing hardware access libraries with it's own versions, which is how it was able to run the few games that it supported so well. It's also why it was unable to run any of the unsupported games at all.
I.e. the sound emulation for a (Genesis) system seems to be a point of contention in the ability to emulate it properly on a dreamcast.
Actually, we fixed that. Works perfectly now, if the emulator is running fast enough. It often isn't.
This isn't a ground up emulator. It's a port of GPF's nincestdc with modifications.
Because of the ability to have high level graphics emulation using the pvr instead of having to run it all in software, emulating the machine is relatively easier. now of course, the processor is much more powerful than that of the snes, but it's not such a large feat as is thought.
N64 emulation on the psp vs the DC is sort of a toss up. On one hand, once could write a low level recompiler to emulate the N64's processor which is similar in many ways. On the other hand, the psp has no graphics hardware, whereas the Dreamcast would be able to emulate the video of the N64 very well.
"When you post fewer lines of text than your signature, consider not posting at all." - A Wise Man
Quzar wrote:N64 emulation on the psp vs the DC is sort of a toss up. On one hand, once could write a low level recompiler to emulate the N64's processor which is similar in many ways. On the other hand, the psp has no graphics hardware, whereas the Dreamcast would be able to emulate the video of the N64 very well.
PSP has 2 Graphics Cores that can run up to 166 MHz.
Quzar wrote:N64 emulation on the psp vs the DC is sort of a toss up. On one hand, once could write a low level recompiler to emulate the N64's processor which is similar in many ways. On the other hand, the psp has no graphics hardware, whereas the Dreamcast would be able to emulate the video of the N64 very well.
PSP has 2 Graphics Cores that can run up to 166 MHz.
Yeah...you know I usually defer to your technical knowledge when it comes to console hardware, Quzar, but are you sure you don't have it confused with the N-Gage? I'm pretty sure the PSP has dedicated graphics hardware.
As far as I know, the psp simply has two of it's main processors. One as a main processor and the other as a 'graphics' processor in a master-slave configuration. It has a processor dedicated to graphics, but the processor is NOT a graphics processor.
edit: so i was working on old information. In the earliest days of psp stuff it was said it had two R4200 333mhz chips. It just turned out to be a single dual core R4200 chip and that homebrew stuff has yet to discover how to take advantage of the graphics hardware at all other than mostly just framebuffer manipulation and 3d software stuff. Yes the psp does have a seperate graphics processor, sorry for the misinformation. At the time though, there is next to no homebrew ability to use it.
"When you post fewer lines of text than your signature, consider not posting at all." - A Wise Man
As far as I know, the psp simply has two of it's main processors. One as a main processor and the other as a 'graphics' processor in a master-slave configuration. It has a processor dedicated to graphics, but the processor is NOT a graphics processor.
Perhaps your thinking about the GP2X. It has a similiar configuration : two 200 Mhz processors, one main and one for graphics. (Which is not a graphics processor but a standard one).
