Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

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Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Roofus » Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:07 pm

A 4-year-old girl shot herself in the chest Monday after snatching her grandmother's handgun from the woman's purse while riding in a shopping cart at a Sam's Club store, authorities said.

A witness, Lueen Homewood, said store workers grabbed first-aid materials off store shelves to help the grandmother as she cradled the wounded child near the store's pharmacy, The (Columbia) State newspaper reported on its Web site.

The girl was rushed to a hospital in critical condition and was recovering Monday afternoon after surgery, said police department spokesman Brick Lewis. Hospital officials would not release her condition after the operation.

Lewis said the grandmother, Donna Hutto Williamson, has a permit to carry a concealed weapon and the purse containing the small-caliber handgun was in the cart near the child. The 47-year-old Williamson, of Salley, was not immediately charged with a crime.

Williamson, a South Carolina magistrate, was distraught after the shooting, her mother-in-law said.

"The grandmother is just beating herself up," said Inease Williamson, 68. "She is just so upset. Everyone is upset."

Officials said the shooting, which was captured on store surveillance cameras, appeared to be accidental. Lewis said police would not release the video.

The store was closed while police investigated the shooting. It reopened Monday afternoon.

"Everyone at Sam's Club is deeply saddened by today's tragedy," Tara Stewart, state spokeswoman for Wal-Mart and Sam's Club, said in a statement. "Our thoughts and prayers are with the little girl and her family."

Concealed weapons permit holders in South Carolina are not allowed to carry weapons into buildings that prohibit it, or into government buildings, schools and daycare facilities, among other places.

The Sam's Club store does not have a sign prohibiting guns inside.

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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Wagh » Tue Jun 10, 2008 5:27 pm

Improper care cases don't mean we need to ban guns.

Sucks for the kid though.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Calavera » Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:17 pm

Roofus wrote: The Sam's Club store does not have a sign prohibiting guns inside.
You can bet they'll have them everywhere now.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by lackofsense » Thu Jun 12, 2008 12:03 am

Calavera wrote:
Roofus wrote: The Sam's Club store does not have a sign prohibiting guns inside.
You can bet they'll have them everywhere now.
I have absolutely no problem with that. In fact, I endorse it.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by FiendWithoutAface » Thu Jun 12, 2008 11:06 am

lackofsense wrote:
Calavera wrote:
Roofus wrote: The Sam's Club store does not have a sign prohibiting guns inside.
You can bet they'll have them everywhere now.
I have absolutely no problem with that. In fact, I endorse it.
You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you. Law abiding citizens are left at a disadvantage.

As for this grandmother. She was extremely negligent and stupid to have a gun within reach of a four year old child. She should have had the weapon holstered on her person or in this case leave it at home.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by |darc| » Thu Jun 12, 2008 11:15 am

What happened to the safety?
It's thinking...
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Specially Cork » Fri Jun 13, 2008 7:50 am

[quote="FiendWithoutAface"]You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you.

Yep. We foolishly prohibited guns in the UK, yet handgun-related raping still happens in stores daily.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by |darc| » Fri Jun 13, 2008 9:48 am

BoneyCork wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you.
Yep. We foolishly prohibited guns in the UK, yet handgun-related raping still happens in stores daily.
That's nowhere even close to a good comparison.

This argument has been done over and over again about guns on university campuses. The argument is basically that if someone had a gun on them, they could have taken out Seung-Hui Cho before he killed 32 people on Virginia Tech's campus. Of course, no one had a gun on them because this all took place in Virginia Tech's gun-free "safe zone." It surely made them safe that day, right?

Basically, you can't expect a gun-free "safe zone" to make anyone safe when those who are able to enter the "safe zone" have a legal right to carry guns outside the safe zone and can enter the safe zone without being checked. All that means is the only people who have guns in the safe zone are the people who don't care about violating the safe zone rule: criminals. Which is certainly less safe than it not being a safe zone to begin with....
It's thinking...
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by FiendWithoutAface » Fri Jun 13, 2008 11:25 am

BoneyCork wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you.

Yep. We foolishly prohibited guns in the UK, yet handgun-related raping still happens in stores daily.
I'm sensing the sarcasm :wink:

That said, the U.K. does have some gun violence. Though because guns are harder to acquire criminals have gone to other means of hurting people. KNIVES. Knife crime is a serious problem in the U.K. While I was over there that was one of the issues that popped up the most on the news. I remember something about a knife amnesty program the police launched nation wide. People were dropping off various bladed objects into bins for them to be rounded up and destroyed.

Of course that didn't remove the knife related violence from the news but thats somewhat off my point. No matter what restrictions society place upon it's citizens it only aids those that do not care about laws. And if a society is capable of magically removing every gun or knife from its country then criminals will resort to using something else to hurt you with. One problem I remember in particular was a couple of cases where druggies were attacking people with their used needles in Chatham, Kent.

Guns or knives are not the real problem. Its people. We cant just ban people so we have to blame and try to ban something else. In this case guns and knives. A %100 safe society has not and will not exist. But we can start taking responsibility for ourselves and our protection and live much safer. Asking our governments to regulate our lives only hurts it never helps.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Jeeba Jabba » Sat Jun 14, 2008 2:18 am

Just like nuclear weapons, when everyone has them, no one can use them.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Covar » Sat Jun 14, 2008 11:52 am

|darc| wrote:What happened to the safety?
Thats a very good question.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Quzar » Sat Jun 14, 2008 1:11 pm

BoneyCork wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you.

Yep. We foolishly prohibited guns in the UK, yet handgun-related raping still happens in stores daily.
Yea, it sucks. Good thing you don't have off the charts knife crime to replace it.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by az_bont » Mon Jun 16, 2008 9:16 am

Quzar wrote:
BoneyCork wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you.

Yep. We foolishly prohibited guns in the UK, yet handgun-related raping still happens in stores daily.
Yea, it sucks. Good thing you don't have off the charts knife crime to replace it.
Except we don't. The most recent article I could find with real figures was this piece from The Guardian, one of the UK's more respectable (non-tabloid) papers:
The Guardian wrote:According to the British Crime Survey, knife-enabled crime (any crime involving a knife) over the past decade has remained stable at around 6-7% of all crime, comprising 30% of all homicides.

In fact, the most recent crime survey by the Metropolitan police showed that knife crime has actually dropped by 15.7% over the past two years, from 12,122 to 10,220 incidents.
The notion that we are under constant threat of attack from a hoodlum armed with a knife is one carefully cultivated by the tabloid press, who treat every isolated incident as indicative of a national trend. There has not been a marked increase in knife crime in the UK, just in the amount of column inches it gets.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Quzar » Mon Jun 16, 2008 1:28 pm

az_bont wrote:
Quzar wrote:
BoneyCork wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:You're only aiding criminals with that mentality. They will not give a fuck if a gun is prohibited if they are out to rob, rape, or kill you.

Yep. We foolishly prohibited guns in the UK, yet handgun-related raping still happens in stores daily.
Yea, it sucks. Good thing you don't have off the charts knife crime to replace it.
Except we don't. The most recent article I could find with real figures was this piece from The Guardian, one of the UK's more respectable (non-tabloid) papers:
The Guardian wrote:According to the British Crime Survey, knife-enabled crime (any crime involving a knife) over the past decade has remained stable at around 6-7% of all crime, comprising 30% of all homicides.

In fact, the most recent crime survey by the Metropolitan police showed that knife crime has actually dropped by 15.7% over the past two years, from 12,122 to 10,220 incidents.
The notion that we are under constant threat of attack from a hoodlum armed with a knife is one carefully cultivated by the tabloid press, who treat every isolated incident as indicative of a national trend. There has not been a marked increase in knife crime in the UK, just in the amount of column inches it gets.
I forgot how honorable and factual US media is. Obviously reports of crime in the UK are exaggerated and here are covered up.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by I.M. Weasel » Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:51 pm

FiendWithoutAface wrote: As for this grandmother. She was extremely negligent and stupid to have a gun within reach of a four year old child. She should have had the weapon holstered on her person or in this case leave it at home.
I mean, if they're having a 2 for 1 sale on 44 gallon mayonnaise drums, and some cracker is grabbing the last one, you gotta blast him, so you can get yours.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by OneThirty8 » Mon Jun 16, 2008 8:36 pm

FiendWithoutAface wrote:A bunch of crap about knives.
If I thought for one second that if we ban guns, the amount of accidental stabbings would rise to match the number of accidental shootings, I might begin to think you had a valid point. Also, if I thought that it would suddenly become as easy to kill a person with a knife as it is with a gun, I might begin to think you had a point. I really can't think of a good reason why average citizens need handguns. I use knives of various descriptions fairly frequently to cut up my food, open boxes, and things of that nature. I can't say that doing such things would be easier with a handgun.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by FiendWithoutAface » Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:35 pm

OneThirty8 wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:A bunch of crap about knives.
If I thought for one second that if we ban guns, the amount of accidental stabbings would rise to match the number of accidental shootings, I might begin to think you had a valid point. Also, if I thought that it would suddenly become as easy to kill a person with a knife as it is with a gun, I might begin to think you had a point. I really can't think of a good reason why average citizens need handguns. I use knives of various descriptions fairly frequently to cut up my food, open boxes, and things of that nature. I can't say that doing such things would be easier with a handgun.
If I thought for one second that if we ban guns, the amount of accidental stabbings would rise to match the number of accidental shootings, I might begin to think you had a valid point
My rant was about crime, not accidents. That being said the accidental shootings are the responsibility of the individual gun owner. Are you implying that the government should fully regulate and shelter its people so that we cant hurt ourselves? Are you willing to allow others to make that decisions for you? I hope not. Accidents are an unfortunate fact of life, be it with guns, cars, sports, cooking, or what have you. Fuck it, lets just ban everything and live in bubble wrap.
Also, if I thought that it would suddenly become as easy to kill a person with a knife as it is with a gun, I might begin to think you had a point.
The issue has nothing to do with what is easier to kill you with. If a criminal can get a hold of a gun they will get one and use it. Now for a close quarters engagement a knife is in fact easier to conceal, wield, and is quieter. Though again thats a none issue. The point is law abiding citizens should be allowed to have the means to protect themselves because a criminal will not care if the gun they have is legal to carry or not.
I really can't think of a good reason why average citizens need handguns.
To protect themselves if need be?
I use knives of various descriptions fairly frequently to cut up my food, open boxes, and things of that nature. I can't say that doing such things would be easier with a handgun
So because you don't use a handgun to open boxes or chop up carrots you think that we shouldn't have them?
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by Quzar » Tue Jun 17, 2008 4:03 pm

The right to gun ownership isn't rooted in self protection, but protection from the government. Revolution isn't really possible if the established power has guns and all you have are knives and sticks.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by FiendWithoutAface » Tue Jun 17, 2008 4:28 pm

Quzar wrote:The right to gun ownership isn't rooted in self protection, but protection from the government. Revolution isn't really possible if the established power has guns and all you have are knives and sticks.
Thats very true and I agree with that %100.
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Re: Girl accidetally excercises her second-amendment rights

Post by OneThirty8 » Tue Jun 17, 2008 8:53 pm

FiendWithoutAface wrote:
OneThirty8 wrote:
FiendWithoutAface wrote:A bunch of crap about knives.
If I thought for one second that if we ban guns, the amount of accidental stabbings would rise to match the number of accidental shootings, I might begin to think you had a valid point. Also, if I thought that it would suddenly become as easy to kill a person with a knife as it is with a gun, I might begin to think you had a point. I really can't think of a good reason why average citizens need handguns. I use knives of various descriptions fairly frequently to cut up my food, open boxes, and things of that nature. I can't say that doing such things would be easier with a handgun.
If I thought for one second that if we ban guns, the amount of accidental stabbings would rise to match the number of accidental shootings, I might begin to think you had a valid point
My rant was about crime, not accidents. That being said the accidental shootings are the responsibility of the individual gun owner. Are you implying that the government should fully regulate and shelter its people so that we cant hurt ourselves? Are you willing to allow others to make that decisions for you? I hope not. Accidents are an unfortunate fact of life, be it with guns, cars, sports, cooking, or what have you. Fuck it, lets just ban everything and live in bubble wrap.
Also, if I thought that it would suddenly become as easy to kill a person with a knife as it is with a gun, I might begin to think you had a point.
The issue has nothing to do with what is easier to kill you with. If a criminal can get a hold of a gun they will get one and use it. Now for a close quarters engagement a knife is in fact easier to conceal, wield, and is quieter. Though again thats a none issue. The point is law abiding citizens should be allowed to have the means to protect themselves because a criminal will not care if the gun they have is legal to carry or not.
I really can't think of a good reason why average citizens need handguns.
To protect themselves if need be?
I use knives of various descriptions fairly frequently to cut up my food, open boxes, and things of that nature. I can't say that doing such things would be easier with a handgun
So because you don't use a handgun to open boxes or chop up carrots you think that we shouldn't have them?
I'd rather not live in fear of the hypothetical boogeyman who is going to bust into my house, steal my TV and rape my women-folk. Guns hurt people. They are not good things to have around. Criminals will always use whatever means they have at their disposal to commit crimes. They're criminals, so that's kinda their thing. You don't seem to take seriously my argument that a gun in the home is an accident waiting to happen, but simple common sense tells me that if I had a gun, I'd be more likely to shoot myself or somebody I know accidentally than an intruder trying to do me harm. Locking the doors at night has always been all the security I need to feel safe in my home. If you're so paranoid that you need a gun in order to feel safe, I think the biggest problem resides in your head.
Quzar wrote:The right to gun ownership isn't rooted in self protection, but protection from the government. Revolution isn't really possible if the established power has guns and all you have are knives and sticks.
Revolution using those means isn't really possible here anyway. The government would bring more people with more guns than you could put together, and that would be the end of the revolution. Plus, it's been a while since we had to kick out King George's occupying force. Things are a bit different now than they were when the Constitution was written. Fortunately, our founding fathers wrote in a means for changing the Constitution so that it can keep up with changing times. These days, most people really don't need firearms.
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