I am ready to pay for an emulator.

MetaFox · Post by **MetaFox** » Tue Jan 06, 2004 7:43 pm

Phantom wrote:
MetaFox wrote:You can't have a contest that will pay people for porting software. It is unethical and immoral (not to mention in some cases illegal - depending on the license agreement) for someone to port someone else's work, and then expect to be paid for it.
I don't really see a problem there. Paying someone a one-time fee for his effort is completely unrelated to the software that's involved.

Even selling a port commercially would be (morally) ok with me, as long as a part of the profits (if any) is contributed back to the original author(s).

Agreed - if the profits are shared equally with all of the original authors, and permission was obtained to obtain money from the work. The problem is, with the contest, it would be very hard to prove that the porter has permission, and all parties will be compensated. If a consent form is required to be signed by all parties before entry is validated, and prize distribution is regulated by the contest organizers to evenly distribute the prize to all contributers to the program, then that would surely be alright.

Heck, I'd even allow that in my DreamOn contest. If all parties are consenting, and prize money is distributed evenly, there is no problem.

Phantom wrote:Btw, what's your opinion on companies like Redhat?

If I'm not mistaken, the Linux license allows for profit to be obtained by using the Linux source. I still believe it's unethical, but in this case it's permitted by the license, as well as Linus and co. themselves.

Phantom · Post by **Phantom** » Tue Jan 06, 2004 7:52 pm

MetaFox wrote:The problem is, with the contest, it would be very hard to prove that the porter has permission, and all parties will be compensated. If a consent form is required to be signed by all parties before entry is validated, and prize distribution is regulated by the contest organizers to evenly distribute the prize to all contributers to the program, then that would surely be alright.

Yeah, but I don't think the contributors would need to be compensated in the case where the resulting software would be 'free'. In that case it would simply be a case of compensating someone for the time they spent porting the program.

MetaFox wrote:If I'm not mistaken, the Linux license allows for profit to be obtained by using the Linux source. I still believe it's unethical, but in this case it's permitted by the license, as well as Linus and co. themselves.

Yeah, Linux is licensed under the GPL. I wasn't just referring to Linux itself though, the CD's that Redhat sell contain hundreds of free software packages.

Anyway, most free software is either GPL or BSD licensed and in both cases, selling is allowed. But that's not really important as this is a discussion of morals.

Post by **Quzar** » Tue Jan 06, 2004 8:43 pm

I dont see where there is a problem as long as the author of the original emu agrees to allow the emu to be ported and knows about the contest...

Ian Micheal · Post by **Ian Micheal** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:51 am

Phantom wrote:
MetaFox wrote:You can't have a contest that will pay people for porting software. It is unethical and immoral (not to mention in some cases illegal - depending on the license agreement) for someone to port someone else's work, and then expect to be paid for it.
I don't really see a problem there. Paying someone a one-time fee for his effort is completely unrelated to the software that's involved.

Even selling a port commercially would be (morally) ok with me, as long as a part of the profits (if any) is contributed back to the original author(s).

Btw, what's your opinion on companies like Redhat?

I agree with you and i know you really understand the GPL lic many others dont seem to.

discussion of morals that seems pretty silly. If you wanted to really think in this fashion you should ask sega every time you put some unlic code running on there machine. Not exactly moraly right is it.

xboxbatman · Post by **xboxbatman** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:31 pm

I have a full speed Genesis Emulator.

Its runs at least 95% with sound and speed. I have the Basic folder and Image on my desktop.

karsten · Post by **karsten** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:40 pm

xboxbatman wrote:I have a full speed Genesis Emulator. Its runs at least 95% with sound and speed. I have the Basic folder and Image on my desktop.

guess it's segagen...
sound looks weird?

Alexvrb · Post by **Alexvrb** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:01 pm

Phantom wrote:
MetaFox wrote:The problem is, with the contest, it would be very hard to prove that the porter has permission, and all parties will be compensated. If a consent form is required to be signed by all parties before entry is validated, and prize distribution is regulated by the contest organizers to evenly distribute the prize to all contributers to the program, then that would surely be alright.
Yeah, but I don't think the contributors would need to be compensated in the case where the resulting software would be 'free'. In that case it would simply be a case of compensating someone for the time they spent porting the program.

Yep.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:25 pm

Ian Micheal wrote:discussion of morals that seems pretty silly.

How are moral arguments silly? I point back to my lego example, or my phone example. Just because something is legal doesn't make it right.

MetaFox · Post by **MetaFox** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 5:14 pm

Ian Micheal wrote:I agree with you and i know you really understand the GPL lic many others dont seem to.

You don't understand jack. Otherwise, you would have read I said illegal depending on the license. Apparently, you aren't aware that the GNU-Public License is not the only license out there. There are many other licenses that are distrubuted with free software. The GPL is only one of many licenses out there, many of which have phrases against this kind of thing.

I'm sick of you constantly bring up the fact that you know the GPL and others don't, because you have proven time and time again that you don't follow the license, and release things the way you want them to be released. You are a completely annoying and worthless human being.

Your release of your game gave some respect from me, but your abrasive and deceitful attitude took it away again. Give up the act Reaper, many people are sick of it.

qatmix · Post by **qatmix** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:05 pm

Steady on Metafox ! just chill out fella. Ian is a character on the scene and he does contribute towards it.

i personally think that charging for a open source emu is dodgy. If the coder wrote his own, then they are able to charge for it if they wish, but getting cash from a port is ropey.

im writing my emu as a labour of love, I dont anticipate charging for it. Whereas if i wrote a game and it was commercial quality then I would have no doubts about selling it.

but thats just my opinion. i just want everyone to get on with each other but im a hippy

MetaFox · Post by **MetaFox** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:12 pm

qatmix wrote:Steady on Metafox ! just chill out fella. Ian is a character on the scene and he does contribute towards it.

He contributes the works of other people. Very few times are the works his own. He uses KOS examples and examples from this message board, and doesn't credit it as so, and he uses other people's work as foundation for his project, and leads people to believe they are his own.

http://s90247988.onlinehome.us/truthteller2k2.html

This is an accurate picture of his "releases" - the ones listed - there are quite a few more that aren't accounted for. He's detrimental to this community. He states that he is for sharing and that he's a huge contributor to the "scene". But, he hides facts and outright lies about his projects. He is about as helpful to the Dreamcast community as Jeffery Dahmer was helpful to the boys that came into his home. Like Dahmer, Reaper proports himself to be a god, and then eats the community alive.

Warmachine · Post by **Warmachine** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:30 pm

Hey this might offtopic in the flame topic but Meta, why do you have so many titles in your avatar. Also is it really that ez to make a SGA release?!

pepitonet · Post by **pepitonet** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:31 pm

MetaFox wrote:
qatmix wrote:Steady on Metafox ! just chill out fella. Ian is a character on the scene and he does contribute towards it.
He contributes the works of other people. Very few times are the works his own. He uses KOS examples and examples from this message board, and doesn't credit it as so, and he uses other people's work as foundation for his project, and leads people to believe they are his own.

http://s90247988.onlinehome.us/truthteller2k2.html

This is an accurate picture of his "releases" - the ones listed - there are quite a few more that aren't accounted for. He's detrimental to this community. He states that he is for sharing and that he's a huge contributor to the "scene". But, he hides facts and outright lies about his projects. He is about as helpful to the Dreamcast community as Jeffery Dahmer was helpful to the boys that came into his home. Like Dahmer, Reaper proports himself to be a god, and then eats the community alive.

So much love put into that page, but if it is true then he is no better than a WAREZer pirate,again i am no pointing finger just expressing my opinion based and assuming what metafox said was true.

ZacMc · Post by **ZacMc** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:35 pm

Meta, why do you have so many titles in your avatar.

I think those are all DC games to be released in 2004.

Warmachine · Post by **Warmachine** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:41 pm

ZacMc wrote:
Meta, why do you have so many titles in your avatar.
I think those are all DC games to be released in 2004.

\

WHERE IS LJSDCDEV

Post by **Quzar** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:48 pm

why so much hate for ian? Genesis plus seems to be coming along nicely, and the gamer's quiz show homebrew looks promising. many authors of emulators release them without any information at all. (homebrew games too) do you demand source from all of them if they claim it is GPL? i have never seen a post where ian demands to be worshipped as a god at all.

MetaFox · Post by **MetaFox** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:49 pm

Warmachine wrote:Hey this might offtopic in the flame topic but Meta, why do you have so many titles in your avatar. Also is it really that ez to make a SGA release?!

They are all games coming soon. Sprint, Trigger Happy, and Brave Suicide are titles in the works for the upcoming DreamOn contest. Puyo Puyo Fever, Psyvariar 2, and Castle of Shikigami 2 are official titles coming in Japan, tryptonite is Cryptic Allusion's upcoming game, and Chikugoyaku (which I have to fix in the avatar, since it's not readable), is Cyberdog Castle's upcoming game.

And, yep it's incredibly simple to make a Single Game Arcade MAME build. I once wrote a tutorial on it, but the site I posted it to went to completely French-only and deleted my tutorial from the site. I'll rewrite it and make it current, and post it to my development site. It's basically as easy as - get the SH4-GCC development environment with KOS set up, download the MAME source, unzip it to a directory, download Ice88's MAME for Dreamcast source, and unzip it to the same directory, edit the makefile with the game you want to build, create a lst file with the hardware for that game, and type MAKE. There's really not much more to it - it's really simple, and fun to do.

Warmachine · Post by **Warmachine** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:51 pm

Do I need to know C/C++...? Because you make it sound like I dont be dont hate the war.

Post by **Quzar** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:55 pm

he seems mad full up on the hating.

MetaFox · Post by **MetaFox** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 7:13 pm

quzar wrote:why so much hate for ian?

He deserves it. He uses other people's code and claims it is his own. He's spammed DCEmu under multiple names after he was banned, and threatened sites with denial of service attacks to try to get them to unban him. He states that he is the Dreamcast scene or that he is the only person in the Dreamcast scene that does anything, and bashes projects of other people - that's as close to claiming that you are a god of the Dreamcast scene as you can get. He used nxQuake as a source for RADQuake, but claimed that he didn't, and that he never even recieved sourcecode from BlackAura. Nothing that I wrote in that article is false. He is truly a bain on the Dreamcast community.

Warmachine wrote:Do I need to know C/C++...? Because you make it sound like I dont.

Believe it or not, to compile a program, you really don't need to know how to program. I've compiled MAME on PC before I even knew an ounce of C. The hardest part is getting the development environment set up, but once that's done - compiling MAME is really simple.