The Ascension Of Vigil

[Tyne]

New version released! I've worked on it for awhile so I don't remember ALL the changes...

- Game boots to the menu instantly, no more demos. Ever.
- 2 New maps, TAoV3.BSP and Tower.BSP! These are BETA maps for testing, these no way represent the final versions at all; I included them to assure you work is being done (they aren't even in the PAK file)
- Updated Castle2 along with totally brand new music
- Graphical tweaks
- Skeletons standing animation is fixed
- Counter attack stab has been replaced with a new animation
- Certain enemies (dogs, knights, hell knights, barons) can be sliced right in half
- More gore, better looking blood!
- Major bug fixes, menu is back to normal, and you won't get that crazy reversal jump randomly
- Replaced ToChris Quake with Makaqu, older version of Darkplaces that doesn't crash randomly anymore
- Camera was updated, it's quite a bit better! It's usually always smooth, and never strays far from the action unlike the old one if Vigil moved too quickly...
- Should load on Dreamcast! (Progs.DAT is no longer compiled with -O3)

Grab it now and forget the embarassment of the last version!

[Tyne]

Anyone try the latest?

[Mr.INSANE]

Yes Quite nice indeed. Although i would still love 2 players like i said way back in quakecon. (sigh) i can dream. On a second note fte supports two screens which means. /drumroll Two player split screen /crowd goes wild

Anyways back onto the game I really must put this on my dreamcast besides that what happened to that new virgil model. Also The menu seems retarded for me on dp Like when you move up and down it like takes awhile to move. Not in the sense that i have a low fps Idk its just weird. Besides that another top notch release

[Tyne]

Yes Quite nice indeed. Although i would still love 2 players like i said way back in quakecon. (sigh) i can dream. On a second note fte supports two screens which means. /drumroll Two player split screen /crowd goes wild

Anyways back onto the game I really must put this on my dreamcast besides that what happened to that new virgil model. Also The menu seems retarded for me on dp Like when you move up and down it like takes awhile to move. Not in the sense that i have a low fps Idk its just weird. Besides that another top notch release

There's up to 4 players, however this is only over network play (maybe FTE, if it runs TAoV; it should) and only cooperative mode is finished, battle mode/versus is not!

The new Vigil (Vigil, not Virgil) model is not completed or even close, also using it will slow down the framerate even more on Dreamcast (it already drops to 14 fps at times)... I don't even know if the new model will ever be used because Chillo's having a hard time animating it the same way I've done it! :P

The menu for me in Darkplaces moves way to fast, it also seems to ignore a switch flag I coded so you're not able to simply hold down a key to move through the menu.. you must TAP it - this works in Makaqu and on Dreamcast.. broken on Darkplaces. argh. [Edit] Bug is now fixed

Anyways, I've already begun work on the next version which has some nice improvements already .. mostly graphical so far (no more Saturn / Genesis dithering present, transparency only now!)

[Edit]

Next version will feature graphical upgrades, including sky boxes!

[law56ker]

Hmm darn I thought you where going tweak the vigil model to give him a more realistic muscular build. Hopefully something like this can still be done. Great work so far, i'm going try the latest build on my xbox since it's easier just uploaded and trying then burning a disc for dreamcast.

[Tyne]

Hmm darn I thought you where going tweak the vigil model to give him a more realistic muscular build.

Vigil has too many frames of animation, and I got sick of it since it's super repetitive work so I stopped as I plan to add even MORE frames to him also; Chillo's model MAY replace Vigil, but I somehow doubt it since he can't import my animations .. and I'm not sure how well he'd mimick my style on his new model.

Oh well, I still don't think Vigil looks all that bad; sure as hell looks better then the quake guy! :P

[Edit]
Next version is possibly gold, also actual gameplay maps still causes the Dreamcast to reboot .. Fixing RIGHT now thanks to nxMakaqu displaying which files it crashes on when developer mode is enabled! speed.spr seems to be the culprit!

TAoV is now fixed on Dreamcast, however there's a LOT of problems!

"nxMakaqu Fatal Error
Mod_ExtraData: caching failed"


is this a RAM problem?

Map compatibility
--------------------

Music ON:
Map01 = Caching failed error
Castle = Loads, after loading it reboots the Dreamcast
TAoV03 = Loads and plays (This level lacks music)
Dungeon = Caching failed error
Castle2 = Loads and plays
Tower = Loads and plays (This level lacks music)

Music OFF:
Map01 = Loads then reboots the Dreamcast
Castle = Out of memory error
TAoV03 = Loads and plays
Dungeon = Loads and plays
Castle2 = Loads and plays
Tower = Loads and plays

This is bad news, Dreamcast or nxMakaqu cannot handle castle.bsp and music in most of the levels.. this may be due to lack of RAM. If music is turned off then TAoV will not attempt to load it (the music files) into RAM at all and more levels will play.

There also may be a Makaqu bug in it's caching of large files? It can't seem to handle larger .wav files.

Also, sky boxes do not load on Dreamcast, but do on PC Makaqu

I guess TAoV is aimed at PC/XBox now? :\
or I may have to cut back Castle.bsp/Map01.bsp quite a bit, darn; I do not support this idea.

[Mr.INSANE]

I can probally help you with optimizng your maps for the dreamcast. /looks at maps

Heres my Assesment of the maps that wont load

Castle = I can see room for improvement mainly theres some areas where func objects should be used

Dungeon = Small room for optimzing but pretty well built

Map 01 = Extremely small margin for optimization stump should be func_ed and maybe some other small things

Ill explain how optimzing works a normal brush interacts with a brush if it touches so if your stump is 1 unit above the ground it wont Vis it

Here we have a box
______
|\ |
| \ |
| \ |
| \ |
|____ \|
Now what if we put a touching object in the middle

______
|\ | / |
|_|-|__ |
| |_| |
| / | \ |
|/__|_\ |
As you see it vises the area making it more complex in turn making your map run slower and file being larger

Now if we func the object it does a. Stop the vising and B. stops shadows from being created

Or we could make the object a unit taller but thats a sort of cheap way todo it anyways

Tyne - You may already know this but its good for the newbs anyways

Besides that your maps look really good i dont see any major problems

Edit: crap seems the forums butchered my badly draw pics but you bsaicly get the point Right?

[Tyne]

Yep I know all about vis, it's not mainly the maps fault .. it's just lack of memory which kills it; I do not want to cut the maps in half at all just so it runs on Dreamcast. If anything, I'd expect a better optimized engine in terms of memory first but who knows if this will ever happen. - NOTE: nxMakaqu may use more ram then the other engines since it bodes more features! -

Also, it could just be that nxMakaqu has a bug with large sound files which would exactly explain why Envenom crashes at the title screen and with maps with music in general.

[Mr.INSANE]

Yeah Even so its always good to have your maps optimized. the cutback with optimization might be to slight to make a difference anyways. Heh with quake once you get the bastard to compile thats a good note that it will run well.

Have you seen lunkins journey /shudders the reason it ran so badly was a combination of horrible mapping and other technical problems. He managed to put 400 or so light ententies in the first level. I bet if i could get the source to the maps i could probally raise the framerate about 20 to 30 or so.

[mankrip]

Next version is possibly gold, also actual gameplay maps still causes the Dreamcast to reboot .. Fixing RIGHT now thanks to nxMakaqu displaying which files it crashes on when developer mode is enabled! speed.spr seems to be the culprit!

Actually, only the files that loaded correctly are displayed, because the engine has no time to update the console messages before freezing. So, this means that if the last file shown in the list is "speed.spr", the file that actually caused the engine to freeze is the one that's loaded after "speed.spr"

Well, maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see how the engine could have time to update the screen when it freezes.

"nxMakaqu Fatal Error
Mod_ExtraData: caching failed"


is this a RAM problem?

I'm not sure what causes this, but I guess it's either lack of RAM or the engine couldn't read the disc (may happen after burning too many sessions).

Castle = Loads, after loading it reboots the Dreamcast

Eek! I didn't have this problem with the mods I've tested, so I have no idea why it is happening there.

There also may be a Makaqu bug in it's caching of large files? It can't seem to handle larger .wav files.

Also, it could just be that nxMakaqu has a bug with large sound files which would exactly explain why Envenom crashes at the title screen and with maps with music in general.

My guess is it's a bug with the SDL sound libraries included in the version of KOS I'm using, since I've not modified the sound driver. It would be good if someone else could compile the engine with a newer version of KOS to see if this solves the problem.

Also, sky boxes do not load on Dreamcast, but do on PC Makaqu

Skyboxes does work on nxMakaqu, I've tested it.

[Tyne]

Well, change of plans concerning TAoV.

1. It's no longer Dreamcast supported
2. Once it's finished, a stripped down version made to run on Dreamcast will be released, then it will be resupported.

That's that.

[edit]
Archers are shooting me with arrows, from the background!! oh noes!


Next versions main feature: BATTLE MODE!

[Tyne]

hehe, another battle mode shot.. we played for about 45 minutes. Battle mode is fun because it runs smoothly on almost any connection (takes about 1 minute of getting used to using GLTaoV). It also takes a lot of skill between players to determine who is better; this is great, how fighting games should be initially.



A new release with:

A) Battle Mode
B) A few improved models and graphical upgrades

will be released shortly!

[law56ker]

Wow i really like how you added the mountains in the backround, i'm guessing it's just a static picture would be awesome to have a moving sky. Is there anyway to make the backround sprite less pixilated, doesn't look too bad just wondering? Your doing an amazing job, How many individual weapons/upgrades can taov have? I was going give you some suggestions on some weapons to add.

[DCmad]

Way back in page 1~2, i sugested some weapons for Vigil, but Tyne said the game is all about the Vol Brand sword, and Vigil couldn't use another thing.
But some trowing darts/arrows/bombs/rocks/anything would be cool.
Some enemies could drop them.

[Tyne]

Other weapons would be neat yes, however I want TAoV to remain a 4 button game + directional movement; not to mention it's already got enough attacks that other weapons aren't even needed.

maybe in taov2 hahaha

[law56ker]

Couldn't you have a button combo to switch weapons? If none are avalible you could use a combo Like Start plus L trigger. I'm going download the newest release and try it on my xbox.

[Tyne]

No, sorry. No other weapons, it was hard enough to animate Vigil + all his actions with 1 weapon and as I said; there's no need for other weapons.

[law56ker]

Tyne do you have any idea why this runs poorly on xbox, my pc isn't much more powerful then on my xbox but it runs nice and smooth on the pc.

Btw great job it's looking awesome from what i played on pc.

Got a couple suggestions. Have different sounds of walking when walking on different surfaces, like a crunchy forest floor, then different sound for hard surfaces such as rocks and such.

The knights you fight kinda look too short and stubby, they would look a little better if then where heighting slightly and or thinned out.

Is there anyway to add jumping intellignce to the a.i where they could jump up on a rock you are standing on and attack you?

Maybe a couple different death animations for enemies and/or vigil. It seems it's always the same one.

More ambient backround sounds. I love the ambient sounds you have in the forest. What about having the abilty of having a pet dog or another creature that is a.i controlled and can fight along side with you at various times in the game.

I also haven't gotten to far into the game but do you use different sounds for when inside a building to have a reverb effect.

I think a mountainess level would be pretty cool where you could be climbing along side or atop a mountain with multiple levels and heights. Maybe you could have rocks falling from above you had to dodge.

Can you add anything like bats flying around, crows, or dragons flying in the sky that would be awesome. What about a little mouse running about the ground or leaves rustling.

When vigil does his 3 move sword attack and he does the little attack where he sticks out the sword and it makes a cling sound, how about if you have vigil do that with two arms and or with a wider stance, it looks very strange when he stick out his single arm with such a heavy sword and his stance is standing straight up. The final swing on that combo should look like a powerful slash or swing the way it looks now it looks like he is holding something that weighs very light.

His stance should stay wider like the two previous sword animations and i suggest him having a two hand sword grip if possible. Maybe you could add some head motion for that also where his head maybe bobs down or whatever. I'm not sure what direction you have him swinging in that animation.


I hope you read my suggestions and tweaks and think about them at least cause I think i am a pretty creative person.

Great work with more tweaks and polish this will be one the most if not the best quake mods anyone has ever seen.

[Tyne]

Tyne do you have any idea why this runs poorly on xbox, my pc isn't much more powerful then on my xbox but it runs nice and smooth on the pc.

It runs poorly on Xbox? That's kerazy, I don't know why as I don't own an XBox...

Got a couple suggestions. Have different sounds of walking when walking on different surfaces, like a crunchy forest floor, then different sound for hard surfaces such as rocks and such.

Can be done but very annoyingly, I'd have to modify every map and put 'triggers' everywhere to tell Vigil which surface he's touching; I'm not doing that. I'll stick with the generic step sound as it's pretty multi-purpose.

The knights you fight kinda look too short and stubby, they would look a little better if then where heighting slightly and or thinned out.

Vigil is tall and slender, Quake Knights are short and stubby; again this may be changed - Chillo has been creating models for TAoV lately.

Is there anyway to add jumping intellignce to the a.i where they could jump up on a rock you are standing on and attack you?

This can be added by mappers (Fake AI!), but I've never figured out a good way for the AI to jump on top of stuff using QuakeC; I can try this I suppose; they do have jumping AI for jumping down off things.

Maybe a couple different death animations for enemies and/or vigil. It seems it's always the same one.

I am, you can slice them in half and I'll add it so you're able to set them on fire and perhaps freeze them and shatter them. I don't plan to add more death frames to Vigil, why? because I'm lazy and I'd rather work on levels and finishing the game THEN polishing it.

More ambient backround sounds. I love the ambient sounds you have in the forest.

Ambient sounds are present in dungeon, castle, and the forest.
The forest ones are noticable, the castle has lightning strikes which aren't part of the music, and the dungeon has those moaning zombies on crosses.

What about having the abilty of having a pet dog or another creature that is a.i controlled and can fight along side with you at various times in the game.

I have something planned for this, basically after you beat the first boss you'll gain a helper friend who cannot be killed but will help you out a bit.

I also haven't gotten to far into the game but do you use different sounds for when inside a building to have a reverb effect.

Nope.

I think a mountainess level would be pretty cool where you could be climbing along side or atop a mountain with multiple levels and heights. Maybe you could have rocks falling from above you had to dodge.

Congratulations, you just described most of Level 2!

Can you add anything like bats flying around, crows, or dragons flying in the sky that would be awesome. What about a little mouse running about the ground or leaves rustling.

That falls under polishing, I can add these.. just not at the moment, priority is A) Gameplay B) Graphics C) Level D) Other crap

When vigil does his 3 move sword attack and he does the little attack where he sticks out the sword and it makes a cling sound, how about if you have vigil do that with two arms and or with a wider stance, it looks very strange when he stick out his single arm with such a heavy sword and his stance is standing straight up. The final swing on that combo should look like a powerful slash or swing the way it looks now it looks like he is holding something that weighs very light.

Vol'Brand is a magic sword! but seriously - this game isn't to be taken seriously (since when can a person shove their sword into metal/rock and remove it? :)) and sure as heck isn't realistic. It's modelled after Guardian Heroes and a few other games where the characters doing their moves aren't very realistic but look very cool.

His stance should stay wider like the two previous sword animations and i suggest him having a two hand sword grip if possible. Maybe you could add some head motion for that also where his head maybe bobs down or whatever. I'm not sure what direction you have him swinging in that animation.

He moves his legs together so he can gain height as he performs the second swing to gain momentum and so the animation doesn't look retarded, then goes for the third strike. These animations are finalized and I like them the way they are.

I hope you read my suggestions and tweaks and think about them at least cause I think i am a pretty creative person.

Great work with more tweaks and polish this will be one the most if not the best quake mods anyone has ever seen.

I like your suggestions, keep em coming! and thanks.

[law56ker]

Any new tidbits?