Marijuana debate

[JellyWarrior]

I don't want to sound like one of those people who say everything is evil but weed IS NOT a safe drug. If this is how you've reacted to it then I think you should stop smoking it, and not smoke it again until you know EXACTLY what happened.

Smoking pot is far more dangerous than people realise and I have heard of people who ruin their lives and / or mental health as a result of smoking weed, it literally takes years for them to recover (years of medical help and staying away from drugs).

Not trying to scare you but I REALLY suggest that you talk to a doctor, leaving the weed portion in because leaving such a vital piece of information out isn't going to get you any kind of valid advice, you're going to get a completely wrong diagnosis if you neglect to mention any of the facts. Your continued good health is worth a little embarrassment or getting a lecture on drugs.

Talk to any doctor who works in an emergency ward and they'll tell you some horrific stories of cases they see from people who smoke marijuana.

I am not trying to stop people from smoking weed but education is key, it's not a safe drug, there is no such thing as a safe drug and I'm sorry to say that it is very common for people to completely ruin themselves as a result from smoking weed (both first time smokers and long term smokers).

People should be educated on the risks before doing anything and then make an informed decision once they know the facts.

[|darc|]

I don't want to sound like one of those people who say everything is evil but weed IS NOT a safe drug. It's far more dangerous than people realise and I have heard of people who ruin their lives as a result of smoking weed, it literally takes years for them to recover (years of medical help and staying away from drugs).

Not trying to scare you but I REALLY suggest that you talk to a doctor, leaving the weed portion in because leaving such a vital piece of information out isn't going to get you any kind of valid advice, you're going to get a completely wrong diagnosis if you neglect to mention any of the facts. Your continued good health is worth a little embarrassment or getting a lecture on drugs.

Talk to any doctor who works in an emergency ward and they'll tell you some horrific stories of cases they see from people who smoke marijuana.

I am not trying to stop people from smoking weed but education is key, it's not a safe drug, there is no such thing as a safe drug and I'm sorry to say that it is very common for people to completely ruin themselves as a result from smoking weed (both first time smokers and long term smokers).

People should be educated on the risks before doing anything and then make an informed decision once they know the facts.

[JellyWarrior]

Laugh all you want, I just don't want to see someone ruin their life.

Luriden please ignore Darc's comment because it literally can ruin lives, it can cause schizophrenia and many other medical conditions.

Get yourself checked out and if you think it's affected you like this then stay away from it.

Many people smoke it their whole lives without a problem but many also damage themselves.

[|darc|]

Laugh all you want, I just don't want to see someone ruin their life.

Luriden please ignore Darc's comment because it literally can ruin lives, it can cause schizophrenia and many other medical conditions.

Get yourself checked out and if you think it's affected you like this then stay away from it.

Many people smoke it their whole lives without a problem but many also damage themselves.

Pot doesn't damage people; damaged people smoke pot. Correlation, not causation.

[bizzle]

I don't want to sound like one of those people who say everything is evil but weed IS NOT a safe drug. If this is how you've reacted to it then I think you should stop smoking it, and not smoke it again until you know EXACTLY what happened.

Smoking pot is far more dangerous than people realise and I have heard of people who ruin their lives and / or mental health as a result of smoking weed, it literally takes years for them to recover (years of medical help and staying away from drugs).

Not trying to scare you but I REALLY suggest that you talk to a doctor, leaving the weed portion in because leaving such a vital piece of information out isn't going to get you any kind of valid advice, you're going to get a completely wrong diagnosis if you neglect to mention any of the facts. Your continued good health is worth a little embarrassment or getting a lecture on drugs.

Talk to any doctor who works in an emergency ward and they'll tell you some horrific stories of cases they see from people who smoke marijuana.

I am not trying to stop people from smoking weed but education is key, it's not a safe drug, there is no such thing as a safe drug and I'm sorry to say that it is very common for people to completely ruin themselves as a result from smoking weed (both first time smokers and long term smokers).

People should be educated on the risks before doing anything and then make an informed decision once they know the facts.

I'm pretty sure you're thinking of crack.

And

[LizzyCamizzy]

Hey Jelly- totally agree with you. I have worked within the court system for years dealing with domestic issues. Weed is dangerous and I've seen first hand the dangers that it can bring, especially long term. Don't let these kids make you feel like you're wrong. You're right. They're just too young to understand yet and have that invincibility feeling still.

Anyway...

Luriden- do see the doctor. I had the same prob last year. Change of jobs, high stress, my blood pressure skyrocketed and I passed out one day. Only the only meds I have to worry about are seizure meds which obviously, are controlled Turned out I had a chemical imbalance due to taking some Nyquil for a cold which did NOT mix with my seizure medication. I shoulda' read that warning label

See the doc. Mention the weed b/c you could have an allergy to it. It is a biological substance after all! Allergies can develop at any time at any age (kinda' like epilepsy or the flu or whatever). If you're allergic, that can prove fatal, so I really agree with Jelly on seeing the doc. If anything to clear up that end of things. You also could go on some good anxiety meds if necessary. Could also be your thyroid going crazy. Same symptoms, except the thyroid will cause you to have mood swings.

[|darc|]

Hey Jelly- totally agree with you. I have worked within the court system for years dealing with domestic issues. Weed is dangerous and I've seen first hand the dangers that it can bring, especially long term. Don't let these kids make you feel like you're wrong. You're right. They're just too young to understand yet and have that invincibility feeling still.

You know, pretty much everyone on this board is about 20.

And no, weed is perfectly safe. "Good" people don't smoke weed. "Bad" people smoke weed. The weed doesn't make them bad, but they only smoked weed because they're bad.

It's like saying "all pot smokers break the law." Being under the influence of pot doesn't make you break the law, but in order to do pot you need to break the law.

So when you see a bunch of idiots or people with issues smoking pot, realize it's not the pot that gave them the issues, it was the issues that made them start smoking pot. Nothing is wrong with the pot itself...

[LizzyCamizzy]

I had a friend die b/c of a reaction to the drug. Please don't talk about safety of weed with me- I can't have tolerance for it b/c it wouldn't be justifiable in her passing. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one and not litter up this thread with a debate between us about this subject.

Man, I'm 25 going on 26! Ya'll are kids comparatively!

**edited for clarification**

[|darc|]

I had a friend die b/c of a reaction to the drug. Please don't talk about safety of weed with me- I can't have tolerance for it b/c it wouldn't be justifiable in her passing. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one and not litter up this thread with a debate between us about this subject.

Man, I'm 25 going on 26! Ya'll are kids comparatively!

I'm sorry for your friend, but anyone can die from a "reaction" to anything, such as those who experience anaphylactic shock from peanut consumption. That doesn't mean peanuts or marijuana are bad in general.

[LizzyCamizzy]

|darc|, I think you are rather cool and I have a lot of respect for you. In that, I don't think I really want to venture down this discussion in this thread. (For many other reasons too- respect for the thread subject is one, as well) I think the subject has been pressed a bit much (and okay, I'm at fault there too and I give my sincere apologies to Luriden). To continue, I'll be happy to in PM. As I said, we'll have to agree to disagree. Nothing wrong in that.

[|darc|]

|darc|, I think you are rather cool and I have a lot of respect for you. In that, I don't think I really want to venture down this discussion in this thread. (For many other reasons too- respect for the thread subject is one, as well) I think the subject has been pressed a bit much (and okay, I'm at fault there too and I give my sincere apologies to Luriden). To continue, I'll be happy to in PM. As I said, we'll have to agree to disagree. Nothing wrong in that.

Then we shall debate here.

[LizzyCamizzy]

awesomeness... I bow to your admin power

Okay! So... I can completely agree with your argument that said bad people aren't bad because they smoke pot, they are bad and therefore smoke pot. There is always a reason to fall into an addiction, whatever that may be. I'm addicted to pink, purely b/c I'm constantly trying to prove to myself and others that I am, indeed, socially acceptable as female. (low key comparison, but makes the point).

The main concerns I have is that there are proven long term effects. For instance (the one that makes me shudder), infertility. This is after long term use, though. Most prescription drugs also cause problems and can agree to this as well, but am sticking with the risks for a federally illegal drug in the US.

Anyway, the infertility issue is a big one. The reproductive hormones stop producing after long-term use. Also proven side effects can include short term memory loss, gradual memory depreciation, lung cancer/emphysema (duh), behavioral warps due to withdrawal, long term memory depreciation, and others. The BIGGEST is the psychosis effect- schizophrenia like symtoms due to frequent use. I'll have to get the case source for you on that one as I'm sure it'll be requested.

Being that these are the effects- how does this make it safe?

On a side note, I would think that something illegal is illegal for a reason...

[jaredfogle]

Marijuana psychosis does happen. I've been around friends during anxiety attacks, etc. that I would place reefer as the most direct cause of.

However, I don't think it is typically a very strong or damaging (though usually embarrassing) psychosis. I've had to help people get back down to earth after intense hallucinogen psychosis-reintegration or readmission is sometimes a chore. Reintegration after marijuana psychosis usually occurs during a nap. Or when the shit wears off.

A lot of the bullshit you hear about LSD making you insane is just that--bullshit. But it is not something to be taken lightly. I think it is inappropriate and dangerous to treat it without reverence as one might booze or reefer. A lot of people do experience lasting psycological trauma during "bad trips," though. These occurances can be vastly reduced in frequency if the drugs used are well-masured and set and setting are considered.

Enough preachy bullshit. I suppose my point is that marijuana is something to be taken lightly. Honestly, if THC can set you off your rocker, you were probably going to get knocked off it by some of the ordinary bullshit in all our lives.

I'm not calling people with anxiety issues pussies, but I think blaming marijuana for a biological disposition is dumb. And you know that worrying about anxiety makes it worse, right? There are ways to steer oneself out of the anxiety spiral before getting lost in it--though it probably isn't always in our power to do so.

[jaredfogle]

On a side note, I would think that something illegal is illegal for a reason...

That's true, but what you've got to consider is whether or not it's illegal for a good reason.

The general consensus among historians concerned with the cause of marijuana's initial criminalization seems to place the cause at anti-Mexican immigrant sentiments.

The wetbacks brought dope with them. They smoked it a lot. Can't outlaw wetbacks, but we can outlaw dope.

So, the first outlawing of reefer in the US probably had its roots in racism. Consider how many black people are sucked into the criminal justice system these days because of anti-marijuana law.

Marijuana prohibition has been a political, not a health, issue.

[JellyWarrior]

LizzyCamizzy I am really sorry to hear about your friend and thanks for sticking up for me.
It's annoying that someone puts his own wrong opinion before another person's health.

Edit
Btw, I have no interest in participating in a "marajuana debate" topic, I've said what I needed to say and people should educate themselves on the risks from a reliable source (not someone who is biased either for or against).

Education lets you know about the risks and gives you an idea about what to do in the event that you see someone having a bad reaction to it.

[LizzyCamizzy]

woosh... I'm tired and will jump back into this tomorrow... Thanks for helping my insomnia tonight guys

ttfn- but the debate will continue!

[LizzyCamizzy]

That's true, but what you've got to consider is whether or not it's illegal for a good reason.

The general consensus among historians concerned with the cause of marijuana's initial criminalization seems to place the cause at anti-Mexican immigrant sentiments.

The wetbacks brought dope with them. They smoked it a lot. Can't outlaw wetbacks, but we can outlaw dope.

So, the first outlawing of reefer in the US probably had its roots in racism. Consider how many black people are sucked into the criminal justice system these days because of anti-marijuana law.

Marijuana prohibition has been a political, not a health, issue.

Hey, while I'm gone- do you have a/the cite for that? I haven't heard that stance before and it's interesting. I'll have to look it up and read more about it!

[LizzyCamizzy]

Anytime, Jelly

[|darc|]

The main concerns I have is that there are proven long term effects. For instance (the one that makes me shudder), infertility. This is after long term use, though. Most prescription drugs also cause problems and can agree to this as well, but am sticking with the risks for a federally illegal drug in the US.

There hasn't been any evidence that any sort of long-term infertility is caused by marijuana. Studies on humans using marijuana have found that while sex hormone production is decreased during marijuana use, it is temporary and limited only to the time the person is using the marijuana. I of course wouldn't believe that habitual use of marijuana is a good thing, not only for health reasons but also for mental reliance on it.

Also proven side effects can include short term memory loss, gradual memory depreciation,

The only short term memory loss proven by marijuana is the temporary loss of memory when it comes to events that happened during the period of time where the person is under the influence of marijuana. There does not appear to be any sort of long-term loss of one's ability to remember recent events.

lung cancer/emphysema (duh),

Definitely a big duh, if you have your lungs' best interests in mind you shouldn't be smoking anything. However, vaporizing marijuana instead of smoking it will minimize this problem greatly.

behavioral warps due to withdrawal,

I don't believe this really has anything to do with actual physical withdrawal. It's a mental dependency on part of the user--not anything to do with the contents of the pot.

The BIGGEST is the psychosis effect- schizophrenia like symtoms due to frequent use. I'll have to get the case source for you on that one as I'm sure it'll be requested.

These effects are not long-term, and only appear when the marijuana is done in very high doses or is eaten.

Being that these are the effects- how does this make it safe?

Because you can look up anything--and by that I don't mean just drugs--and find similar crap about how it has this or that effect. Most of these effects require that the user use a large amount of marijuana over a long period of time, and I would argue that habitual use of anything in such large amounts is just a stupid thing to do.

Substances such as alcohol, which is obviously legal, have shown to be more damaging to one's health and have a much higher addiction rate than marijuana.

On a side note, I would think that something illegal is illegal for a reason...

I don't really think this is a legitimate point at all. The government has been extremely stubborn on the issue because of the historical fight against it. Marijuana remains a schedule I (the worst) "drug" up there with heroin, with the argument that it has an high potential for abuse, has no current medical acceptance, and there is no safe method to use the drug under medical supervision. All three of these are bullshit or at least highly questionable to the extent of placing the substance in the highest tier of drugs. Other substances such as cocaine and meth aren't even in that tier of drugs. In addition, if you look at some of the propaganda from the government in the original era of banning marijuana, it's hilariously wrong. Early propaganda films show people smoking pot and immediately going insane and doing crazy things. None of it is realistic, but it all contributed to a historical stigma against pot that just won't go away. Consider these quotes by Harry J. Anslinger, who led a campaign against marijuana:

"An entire family was murdered by a youthful addict in Florida. When officers arrived at the home, they found the youth staggering about in a human slaughterhouse. With an axe he had killed his father, mother, two brothers, and a sister. He seemed to be in a daze… He had no recollection of having committed the multiple crime. The officers knew him ordinarily as a sane, rather quiet young man; now he was pitifully crazed. They sought the reason. The boy said that he had been in the habit of smoking something which youthful friends called “muggles,” a childish name for marijuana."

"[African American]s' satanic music, jazz, and swing, result from marijuana use. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers and any others"

[jaredfogle]

That's true, but what you've got to consider is whether or not it's illegal for a good reason.

The general consensus among historians concerned with the cause of marijuana's initial criminalization seems to place the cause at anti-Mexican immigrant sentiments.

The wetbacks brought dope with them. They smoked it a lot. Can't outlaw wetbacks, but we can outlaw dope.

So, the first outlawing of reefer in the US probably had its roots in racism. Consider how many black people are sucked into the criminal justice system these days because of anti-marijuana law.

Marijuana prohibition has been a political, not a health, issue.

Hey, while I'm gone- do you have a/the cite for that? I haven't heard that stance before and it's interesting. I'll have to look it up and read more about it!

http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/hem ... tomj1.html

Or google "marijuana tax 1937 mexican." There are a lot that say the same.

Marijuana was actually briefly legal in the US in the 1960s when Timothy Leary contested the the 1937 Tax Act as unconstitutional. We're not supposed to ever have to turn ourselves in, but one basically had to do so to comply with the Tax Act. You had to go to the government and tell them that you had an illegal drug to get the stamps. They tried to get Leary on it and he busted the shit all up. Of course it was quickly replaced by some other law that was technically constitutional.

Anti-marijuana sentiment was used to socially ostricize a lot of young, radical-leaning young people in the 1960s. Again, the motivations are political, not concern for our health.

We've actually got a new law here in TN called the Crack Tax that is just as unconstitutional. It is actually being enforced, I think. I've not seen any official reports, but I heard that this is the standard new method of enforcement at festivals I've attended. Instead of having to process you, arrest you, etc. they will simply make you pay a 100% tax (and cops notoriously overvalue dope) and take your stuff. Easier for them and it almost seems like they're giving you a break by not arresting you.

Also, a lot of black folks smoke reefer. I think its prohibition leads to a lot of undeserving young and old black people getting imprisioned or put on probation. Probation can really be a bitch when paying rent is difficult on its own.