MUGEN VS BOR

[IiLuSiv]

This is not a MUGEN port request, DO NOT MISCONSTRUE THIS POST.

This is a post about Mugen and BOR.

What I mean to say in this post is this. Recently, I had a conversation on another forum where people were wondering why SNES emulation was not at the level that NEOCD emulation is, comparitvely on the dreamcast. I said, because the NEO CD, was designed to run of a CD based system, thus emulated it, you are using a faster cd rom drive, and more memory on an advanced system like the DC being an extremely fitting platform for the emu. Where as SNES, is cartridge based system and thus an emu on the DC actually runs into many restrictions since most or part of the game would have to be loaded in to the memory which may not be adequate, especially when compared to a system that already runs on CD.

I'm no guru, this is just how I figured.

I was playing BOR recently and was thinking...Damn, they have a lot of on screen characters and very little slowdown, this is pretty cool for a DC homebrew.

Mugen has consistently been ruled on unfeasible for the DC, but why is this?

Why is BOR quite apt for the DC but Mugen or a MUgen like game seen as posssibly a major programming challenge.

A one on one fighter has far less on screen characters than BOR....can someone explain this to me?

[Tyne]

Simple, there's no Mugen source code out there to port it over to Dreamcast. There's also RAM issues, Mugen characters are huge and require more processing power as well as LOT more RAM than BoR needs due to the amount of frames / sound effects / special effects / transparencies being thrown all over the screen.

Mugen IS on Xbox but it's through a hacked up port running through Linux and often runs out of RAM even though Xbox itself has 64mb which is way more than Dreamcast.

[Tyne]

Double post.

[IiLuSiv]

So the sprites on BOR are just pretty ran down, and simple compared to MUGEN one's I imagine...

[Christuserloeser]

Maybe, I don't know, but I know that the Beats of Rage code is extremely optimized for low spec platforms - About four years of work went into the engine and many of that went into RAM optimizations done by various talented people (but most by Roel, Neill Corlett, and SX); all to make sure a game like Battletoads or Final Fight: Last Round does fit into the Dreamcast's 16MByte main RAM (video and sound RAM currently aren't used).

Mugen isn't open source; the best way to get a 1 on 1 fighting engine working on Dreamcast would be to just use OpenBoR. I remember that Savant had a concept for that a while back...

Anyway, the best place to discuss this would be http://www.lavalit.com/

[bigmenace]

so would the fightmaker 2k & shoot maker engine be impossible also? i know they ported mugen to psp but looks like it won't ever grace the dc

[IiLuSiv]

That sounds awesome, I am definetely going to look into that. OPEN BOR to Mugen type game. I think it could be done...thank you for the info

[IiLuSiv]

Does anyone have any links to similar speculation on the subject?

[Sir Savant]

Maybe, I don't know, but I know that the Beats of Rage code is extremely optimized for low spec platforms - About four years of work went into the engine and many of that went into RAM optimizations done by various talented people (but most by Roel, Neill Corlett, and SX); all to make sure a game like Battletoads or Final Fight: Last Round does fit into the Dreamcast's 16MByte main RAM (video and sound RAM currently aren't used).

Mugen isn't open source; the best way to get a 1 on 1 fighting engine working on Dreamcast would be to just use OpenBoR. I remember that Savant had a concept for that a while back...

Anyway, the best place to discuss this would be http://www.lavalit.com/

Actually, I had a working alpha of this, very cruddy and since I was unfamiliar with the whole coding engine, I kinda broke a few things (plus I ran out of memory). Of course, I also emailed for source to the 3 and 4 Player BOR modded engines and never got those. I kinda gave up after this summer was over and especially once my data hard drive was corrupted (Note: never try to combine two NTFS partitions without backing up that data somehow)

Also complicating the issue is the fact that there exist five or six different BOR versions on the BorGeneration website. I've never been TOO into BOR so I don't know what the difference between them all is. Someone would do well to explain this, because it looks like the main development has stopped (from a glance at the BorGeneration website) and I would think that anyone looking to hack at the engine would have a rought time of doing so.

Do changes to the OpenBOR or similar engines port over to other consoles?

So many questions, so little answered.