Xbox One announcement

General purpose discussion about gaming and emulation.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Fri May 24, 2013 1:57 am

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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Specially Cork » Fri May 24, 2013 11:48 am

|darc| wrote:Yeah, but that's just graphics.
The visuals are the most important feature of a visual medium. When a games creator has a vision, but is held back by dated technology, it's time for an upgrade.

The current console generation is restraining games development.
|darc| wrote:Getting a new generation of consoles is supposed to be more exciting than upgrading your computer's hardware.
I completely disagree. The hardware upgrade is the most important part of any new console generation and therefore, is the most exciting part of it.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by cube_b3 » Fri May 24, 2013 5:21 pm

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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by I.M. Weasel » Sun May 26, 2013 10:55 am

not just souLLy now wrote:I'm sure it will find its feet eventually but it was pretty dire in general.
Glad they didn't mess with the controller too much.
Voice control looks awful, the last thing I want to do is talk to my TV.
Always on kinda. Awful.
No used games. Awful.
Call of Duty and sports games, don't care, nothing that hasn't been done to death this generation already.
TV integration meaningless to me, I have a modern Smart TV.
Box looks big, the vents all over suggest it'll be noisy.
Show me a killer app for Kinect and I'll consider it useful.

Once Nintendo first party stuff starts appearing I think the Wii-U is going to look like a reasonable option. Currently the 3DS is my console of choice.

As others have mentioned (and from what I read on other sites) regarding XBone...
No used games.
once per day (at least) phone home to verify legitimacy of games.
phone home on initial game boot - upgrades, legitimacy.
Always on Microphone & Video camera into your living room. Big bro could be a problem here, but what about regular hackers? They would love that up.
No bringing a game over to a friends house (they will have to essentially pay the purchase price to run it on their system under their gamer tag) Or you can sign in with your tag at their house...
forced XBLA subscription.

We all would like to see the next gen, but at what cost? All this BS just to play the latest games? Where do you draw the line?
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Lartrak » Mon May 27, 2013 12:37 am

I might get a PS4 someday. But the licensing of games from Microsoft, a company I frankly don't really trust, is something that kills the system for me. That, and I don't need another media machine.

I'll also agree it doesn't really feel needed. Unmemorable jump.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Specially Cork » Mon Jun 10, 2013 1:05 pm

E3 presentation just finished. Lots of games shown so credit where it's due, but not a one I want and for £429 they can **** right off. Sony had the Blu-Ray excuse with PS3 but really...it's just too much.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:18 pm

The Xbox One could have the greatest games in the world as exclusives, and I still wouldn't buy one because of the absurd DRM scheme. That's how ridiculous it's gotten.

I think they've gotten to this place (and it really started with the PS3, but back then it was at least somewhat deserved) where they think of their systems--and thus market them--as premium products. But a game console has always been about a balance of power, convenience, game design, and affordability. In recent years that's expanded to be "set-top box," but at it's heart it's still essentially a toy. The Xbox One in particular seems to have forgotten that. That's a LOT of money to pay for a system that offers few new features, won't play any of your existing content, and won't let you own any of the games you've bought.

What a mess.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by |darc| » Mon Jun 10, 2013 4:05 pm

I don't really think they're going for it to be a "premium" product, it's just that in the 80s, 90s, and early 00s video game systems were primarily toys for kids and teens. You can only make a product for that age group so high since parents aren't going to ever buy something super expensive for their kids. Now these devices are targeted to adults, and they are supposed to encompass everything you do in your living room--no more turntable, VCR, cassette deck, CD player, DVD player, Blu-Ray player, DVR, or video game console. You just have the Xbox. If you just want to play video games, then the only video game console left is the Wii U.
It's thinking...
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Mon Jun 10, 2013 4:36 pm

Yeah, but here's the problem. That strategy still sorta-worked with the 360 and PS3, because a lot of people were still upgrading from older standards, and the idea of streaming and downloaded content in the living room was still finding its way into the mainstream. But now, most of their target audience already has devices that do those things just as well if not better. The sense of value you get from those additional features isn't there any more, and it's certainly not enough to offset the loss of any form of backwards compatibility. You don't get to play ANY of your old downloads, you can't play ANY of your old games, and you don't even have free reign to use the NEW games you buy unless your system can check in every 24 hours.

Even worse, once Microsoft sunsets the system, the entire thing will stop working unless they decide to be uncharacteristically generous and patch the DRM system to remove all the restrictions. Once those servers shut down in 5 or 10 years, every Xbox One on the planet will be a useless chunk of silicon, and every game you "bought" for it will just be a memory and money down the drain.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by melancholy » Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:01 pm

DaMadFiddler wrote:and every game you "bought" for it will just be a memory and money down the drain.
No they won't. They will be 4K HD remakes just ready to be bought again!
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:10 pm

Shall I list the PS2 games I have that were never released as downloads for PS3? Or the NES and SNES games I have that never came out on Wii Virtual Console?

Not only is the Xbox One's philosophy horribly anti-consumer, it's also dramatically exacerbating an already-looming problem with video games: here we have a (relatively) new medium, an entire new art form at risk of being completely lost to history. We already have the problem of proprietary media only being usable as long as there is still a working player for it somewhere in the world. Now we have the issue of that media effectively self-destructing once it is discontinued. There's no way people will get on board with this.

They should've just called the thing Xbox Last.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by melancholy » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:01 pm

Microsoft just announced the retraction of every bad decision they made. It can now play used games, doesn't require Internet, and, most surprisingly, is now region free.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by |darc| » Thu Jun 20, 2013 1:33 am

Not every bad decision. Still requires Kinect...
It's thinking...
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:47 am

...and completely lacks backwards compatibility, even for downloaded titles. But Sony's no better in that regard.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Juan » Thu Jun 20, 2013 7:07 am

Could this be the beginning of a "console wars" of consumer friendly approaches? Not likely, but one can dream, eh.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Specially Cork » Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:25 am

DaMadFiddler wrote:...and completely lacks backwards compatibility, even for downloaded titles. But Sony's no better in that regard.
$10 should be enough for a shelf and an HDMI switcher.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:53 am

...and what happens when that older system dies? 360s aren't exactly known for their build quality ;)
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Jeeba Jabba » Thu Jun 20, 2013 2:25 pm

DaMadFiddler wrote:...and what happens when that older system dies? 360s aren't exactly known for their build quality ;)
Would you be willing to pay an extra $100-$200 for them to stuff the 360 hardware under there? You do realize the One is x86, right?
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by DaMadFiddler » Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:24 pm

Jeeba Jabba wrote:
DaMadFiddler wrote:...and what happens when that older system dies? 360s aren't exactly known for their build quality ;)
Would you be willing to pay an extra $100-$200 for them to stuff the 360 hardware under there? You do realize the One is x86, right?
I'm well aware of the architecture differences, and I really don't understand why that's treated as a legitimate excuse. Finding an effective way to create a product that meets consumer needs is THEIR problem, not mine.

Last year, our cat broke the Wii. (She learned that nuzzling the power button caused warm air to come out the side vent, so she'd turn it on at night while we were asleep and snuggle up to the vent. It wasn't too long before it overheated.) That left us without a way to play our not-insignificant library of Wii games. When the Wii U came out, I was a bit skeptical of its sparse launch lineup, but the fact that it would also replace the Wii was enough to drive our interest. Without that feature, we'd still be waiting for the Wii U library to fill out... and may have considered skipping it altogether.

Conversely: last fall, my launch-model PS3 broke. (Last year was a bad year for things breaking, but that's another story.) As a result, I have a cabinet full of games that I no longer have a way of playing. If the PS4 had maintained compatibility with the earlier PlayStation models, I would have preordered one ASAP and that would take care of it. But as it stands, we have a big cabinet full of PS, PS2, and PS3 games (not to mention the DLC titles purchased on my account). Instead of buying the new system, we went out and got a replacement PS3. But the PS3's product life is gradually coming to an end, and we can't just keep replacing it every few years. The lack of backwards compatibility made the difference between ordering the PS4 and ignoring it.

What if other content industries worked this way? Sure, new technology comes along every now and then which necessitates a format change, but it's nowhere near the frequency of a console generation. Can you imagine having to re-buy all of your music every 3-5 years, just because the players don't last, and each time they come out with a new one, they change formats and drop support for the older format. Video formats have a slightly higher turnover rate, but DVD players will play VideoCDs, and Blu-Ray players will play both of those previous formats as well.

Software is the only medium we treat this way, where sunsetting the actual media is completely acceptable and library building/maintenance is treated as a special case with no solution rather than an obvious and common need.

I think I'm done. I'm not buying any more consoles that don't explicitly address the ability to maintain a library over time.
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Re: Xbox One announcement

Post by Juan » Thu Jun 20, 2013 4:13 pm

Fun fact: The Wii U doesn't support Gamecube games.
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