Dreamcast Classic

General purpose discussion about gaming and emulation.
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Dreamcast Classic

Post by politoe » Sun Dec 22, 2019 11:02 am

With recent 90s Megadrive/Genesis.
Who knows if well see a Saturn Classic.
DC classic a possibility.
What games will come included?
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by |darc| » Mon Dec 30, 2019 9:09 pm

I don't see it happening. There's no hardware they could use to accurately emulate the DC that would also be cheap enough.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Moopthehedgehog » Tue Jan 07, 2020 1:26 am

Oh yeah?
https://www.digipart.com/part/HD6417091RA
150k+ SH7091s, $8 a pop.
Who needs to emulate when you can still buy the actual CPUs for a pittance?

Get the holly on an fpga and that’s about $100 for a Dreamcast “redux.” It may even be possible to do it for less.
(I doubt SEGA will be the ones to do it, but who knows? IMO they could just re-release the Dreamcast and make more BBAs and make like 90% profit on it.)
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Nico0020 » Wed Jan 08, 2020 10:42 pm

Give it another ten years or so. Don't need another half-assed mini system like Sony did. Heck it took a lot for Sega to even be able to get the Genesis mini as good as they did.

Mini consoles of 6th gen stuff is going to be a much harder sell I think. There is a different kind of nostalgia for 8/16 bit consoles that the 5th and 6th gen consoles never captured.

Personally I'd love to see a Saturn made, just because so many of those titles were never ported to anything at all. Saturn's 2D heavy library also makes those games easier to digest than the PS1's extensive Dorito based 3D library.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Eviltaco64X » Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:28 am

Nico0020 wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 10:42 pm
Mini consoles of 6th gen stuff is going to be a much harder sell I think. There is a different kind of nostalgia for 8/16 bit consoles that the 5th and 6th gen consoles never captured.

Personally I'd love to see a Saturn made, just because so many of those titles were never ported to anything at all. Saturn's 2D heavy library also makes those games easier to digest than the PS1's extensive Dorito based 3D library.
N64 Classic would do really well. Nintendo could probably make one with no trouble, but the controllers would be bigger than the system itself. I'd guess they're a lot more expensive to make than NES/SNES controllers. Add to that, the boxes would probably be gigantic if they packed 2 controllers in. It goes against the whole Mini thing too much

Saturn Mini (anything 6th Gen and later) I only see happening whenever RetroPie or some equivalent becomes passable enough.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Juan » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:11 pm

I mostly want a comprehensive Sega arcades compilation, in a format like the current Mega Drive collection.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Moopthehedgehog » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:56 pm

I came across this random thing recently:
http://ebook.pldworld.com/_eBook/SEGA/1 ... amcast.pdf
It's a complete cost-analysis of the Dreamcast hardware done in 2000 (it's legit, too: Portelligent has since been bought by CMP Technologies, which were then bought by UBM. Same company behind the EE Times). The prices in the BOM have really not changed much, so even if one were to rebuild the Dreamcast from the ground up, it would cost very nearly the same now as it did then to make.

I also find it insane that they were losing $50 on every console they were making. That means they would have needed to sell about 3 games per console to break even. The holly chip is an absolute monster, and a best-case FPGA implementation of that chip now would be at least the same price--not a chance of it being any cheaper.

That's $250 to build a Dreamcast from scratch at some kind of scale, even now.
And good luck finding the video encoder chips: the best I've seen is 5 for over $80 on Aliexpress.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Eviltaco64X » Fri Jan 17, 2020 6:07 am

Juan wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:11 pm
I mostly want a comprehensive Sega arcades compilation, in a format like the current Mega Drive collection.
That would be a great idea if it was pulled off right. Licensing troubles with 3rd party IPs would be the toughest problem to sort out.
Moopthehedgehog wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:56 pm
I came across this random thing recently:
http://ebook.pldworld.com/_eBook/SEGA/1 ... amcast.pdf
It's a complete cost-analysis of the Dreamcast hardware done in 2000 (it's legit, too: Portelligent has since been bought by CMP Technologies, which were then bought by UBM. Same company behind the EE Times). The prices in the BOM have really not changed much, so even if one were to rebuild the Dreamcast from the ground up, it would cost very nearly the same now as it did then to make.

I also find it insane that they were losing $50 on every console they were making. That means they would have needed to sell about 3 games per console to break even. The holly chip is an absolute monster, and a best-case FPGA implementation of that chip now would be at least the same price--not a chance of it being any cheaper.

That's $250 to build a Dreamcast from scratch at some kind of scale, even now.
And good luck finding the video encoder chips: the best I've seen is 5 for over $80 on Aliexpress.
If you don't build your Dreamcasts from scratch, you're not dreaming
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by politoe » Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:18 pm

Just delivered at SOA Burbank office, (they've got a few satellite offices.)put in good word for the community. You guys just keep fucking thinking.
Ima post the Sonic statue pic in a bit.
Also used my 401k to purchase 23 shares of stocks at around $4 a pop before the movie released.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Moopthehedgehog » Sat Feb 29, 2020 12:59 am

Ah, I've been meaning to send them a letter asking if they'd be willing to provide the community with hardware documentation. We don't actually need the SDKs or anything, just an official source for official hardware docs/errata sheets/specifications would be super nice. Even a modern day Dreamcast developer portal is something I'd sign up for. There's a lot of stuff that's been floating around, but no idea if any of it is OK to use from any legal standpoint. Especially the Holly chip, AICA, G1/G2 bus, and really anything not the SH4 because STMicro and Renesas have really good/freely available docs for that (well, SH7750, which is, as far as I can tell, an identical chip).

Actually, thanks to those SH4 docs I've already been able to hit some theoretical maximum numbers on the SH4, and through reverse engineering my own machines got high resolution video modes out over VGA like 720p, 1440x900, and a real native widescreen mode of 848x480 (832x480 internally due to hardware limitations). A Dreamcast classic would see none of this, by the way. There's so much performance left on the table that the Homebrew/Indie community just can't make full use of without those kinds of documents for everything else.

EDIT: Apparently there exists a "Dreamcast on a Chip" used in the Sega System SP arcade board, with chip model SH3707. I guess if Sega wanted to make a "Classic" that would probably be the thing to use. Actually, that might even make such a console compatible with all this stuff.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by politoe » Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:00 pm

Image

SOA Burbank Sonic Pillar Head office
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Eviltaco64X » Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:58 pm

politoe wrote:
Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:18 pm
Just delivered at SOA Burbank office, (they've got a few satellite offices.)put in good word for the community. You guys just keep fucking thinking.
Ima post the Sonic statue pic in a bit.
Also used my 401k to purchase 23 shares of stocks at around $4 a pop before the movie released.
SEGA/SAMMY/ATLUS WEST took note.
:spingrin: -> :teehee: "got 2 go fast" -> :spingrin:
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by not just souLLy now » Thu Mar 26, 2020 4:38 pm


?
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Eviltaco64X » Mon Mar 30, 2020 4:37 pm

not just souLLy now wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 4:38 pm

?
That looks nice. It's pretty consistent with the DC aesthetic.
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by |darc| » Mon Mar 30, 2020 11:01 pm

not just souLLy now wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 4:38 pm

?
You should work with mrneo240 on theming for his replacement GDEMU frontend openmenu
It's thinking...
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Re: Dreamcast Classic

Post by Arvex » Mon Mar 30, 2020 11:06 pm

I never really liked the mini/classic consoles. The only one that caught my interest was the SNES mini because it came with an official release of Star Fox 2, but when I saw it at a convention, it ran horribly on the SNES mini. Don't know if the build they put on there was poorly optimized or if the SNES mini was just not built for running that game (emulation quality issue?) I don't want to hack up a SuperFX chip game to make a Star Fox 2 cart to test that currently. Not to mention that it would likely not have any online capability because Sega probably wouldn't want to put the money into hosting servers for any of the games that they might put on there.

Instead of a Dreamcast Mini, I'd rather see Sega embrace the Dreamcast as the console for homebrew developers. Make a new run of MIL-CD capable Dreamcasts or at least work with hardware manufacturers to make a GD-R and matching burner available for the homebrew community. Re-issues of Dreamcast games that might be harder to find would be nice, too.

Now I'm kind of curious if Sega were to produce new Dreamcasts, how much they would sell them for. It should be cheaper to make now because the costs on its parts have fallen, but there is also inflation. (Retail price of the Dreamcast at the time of its US launch is the equivalent of $300 after inflation.) There is also the question of how much of the price is licensing for software and firmware that ran the Dreamcast.
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