'Radquake Final' and mods...

Talk about Quake, Doom, Wolfenstein 3D, or other DC first person shooting game ports and mods for those games in here.
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Post by q_006 » Mon Aug 30, 2004 11:39 pm

so who's going to be working on RADQuake now?
or is it really 'final'??
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Post by TheDumbAss » Tue Aug 31, 2004 11:45 pm

I thought Fragger added an invert option to the menus... hmm...

I know its a simple thing to do if it isnt in there... because if it wasnt there at all I added the options to QuakeX's menu for inverting BOTH analog sticks instead of just the right stick.

And I have no clue why Ian would have went in and did that to the step height. That seems like a completely random thing to edit. and why to 30??
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Post by mankrip » Wed Sep 01, 2004 1:22 am

http://quakedev.dcemulation.org/fragger ... 0final.mht

Luckly I was smart enough to save this page before Ian Micheal deleted my posts. He also removed my moderator status and set my status to "last warning", and put up an announcement saying that anyone who tries to "hijack" his topics with "off-topic" statements will be banned.

speud: I don't think that any of these two posts that Ian deleted had anything offensive, and I think that you will agree with me. One of the reasons why I posted this here is because Ian Micheal deleted it before you had any chance to see it.

Well, I don't care if Ian Micheal bans me from his forums. I don't have anything to do in there anymore.
Last edited by mankrip on Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by BlackAura » Wed Sep 01, 2004 1:29 am

Well, Tyne just posted something similar. So I guess he's going to get banned too.
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Post by mankrip » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:03 am

Tyne's post was deleted, but he asked me to post it here:
MHT
HTM

This one wasn't deleted yet:
MHT
HTM

Same as above, but Tyne edited it a bit:
MHT
HTM

I was told that these MHT files doesn't work with Mozilla, so I'm going to put HTML versions soon.

[edit:]Added the HTM versions.
Last edited by mankrip on Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by speud » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:10 am

do you really think that belongs here seriously?
someone wasnt nice with me in the metro last week, should i post it in here as well? :|
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Post by mankrip » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:33 am

Those posts were originally posted at the IMR forums. I had no intention to post them here, but Ian Micheal deleted them to prevent the public from seeing them.

And I don't like to be blamed for problems that are not my fault, so I think I have the right to explain why what he said is not true.
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Post by ajay() » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:35 am

speud, it's entirely relevant, it's about the deteriating nonsense that's succeeded in mucking up what was community project - just because you and Ian have been doing the latest work, doesn't mean that it's "yours". Neither of you started it, and, ultimately it's gpl anyway.

Without id showing more maturity and and a better community sensibility, we wouldn't even have this software to be using on our dreamcasts. You don't get that do you? You complain about people highlighting problems with your port, but forget (or don't even know) that Quake was coded completely with modders in mind, it's structure and features were influenced by feedback for the doom community, and it's success to this day is because it still, after many years, has a thriving mod community.

You can turn your back from that if you want, but think, and in all modesty, if me, TDA, Tyne, Fragger, FrikaC and many others hadn't been trying to get mods working with dc quake, do you even think there'd be much of an audience for the latest update to a dc quake port? Do you miss all the posts saying that people are excited to be palying a "new game" on their dreamcast, because a new mod gives them that?

The latest port doesn't support features that:
1) Basic quake does
2) Later versions do
These are important in allowing a creative dc mod community, you've never been attacked for their abscence, they have just been pointed out, you've been attacked for your attitude afterwards.
In Raptors! there's a level where the lights turn out, however in Titanium's port, dynamic lights don't work, is that a fault with my mod? Or is that soemthing that a complete port would include?
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Post by speud » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:48 am

have fun, i wont waste my time in here anymore.
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thx to Wack0 for the avatar ;)
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Post by BlackAura » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:49 am

Just wondering, did anyone ever try changing the value of r_dynamic in Titanium's port?
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Post by ajay() » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:54 am

speud wrote:have fun, i wont waste my time in here anymore.
We'll cope.
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Post by mankrip » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:56 am

r_dynamic has no effect in QuakeDC.

The HTM version of my posts (where I explained about the stepsize problem) is uploaded:
MHT
HTM
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Post by BlackAura » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:59 am

r_dynamic has no effect in QuakeDC.
Which means they yanked the dynamic lighting code. While experimenting with GLQuake on the Dreamcast, I found that the dynamic lighting code slows things down to a crawl. Basically, it needs serious modification ot get it working well enough on the Dreamcast. That's probably why they just removed it.
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Post by Tyne » Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:28 am

I said it to Fragger and I'll say it again here, speud and Ian are the type of people who will hate you for life, ban you and act like jerks to you if you're pointing out flaws and things that need fixing in their work rather then praising them and treating them like they're #1 - which they're clearly not.
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Post by Tyne » Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:30 am

speud wrote:do you really think that belongs here seriously?
someone wasnt nice with me in the metro last week, should i post it in here as well? :|
Sorta like how you wrote names of people you dislike in the RADQuake Final readme? Hypocrite.
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Post by Quzar » Wed Sep 01, 2004 12:50 pm

If his mod works fine on the PC version of Quake, but does not work properly on the DC version of RADQuake, and RADQuake is supposed to be a port of Quake, there is nothing wrong with the mod, there is something unsupported, or broken in the ported engine. Saying it is the porter's responsibility to make all mods work oversteps boundries, but it also isnt the fault of the modder, especially if the mod was targeted at PC Quake. Bugs are bugs. Errors are errors. Focus should not be put so much on to who is to blame, but the fact that a solution has been found. Its sad that the first thing that happened when the step define problem was found was that everyone was like 'who did this?' instead of "who will fix this for us?" (to reiterate this is aimed at everyone, here and elsewhere, because you all did this).

That all being said, we also have to all remember that all devvers(be they coders, artists, modders, or any other thing) do not have an obligation to the scene, or to the users at all. So, users, you shouldn't be mean to a devver if he did something you dont like. At the same time though, devvers, users have no responsibility to you either, so if they do complain or mock you, insult you or otherwise, they have no responsibility at all to be courteous( although it is a nice thing...).

All in all, we must always keep in mind, we do this, be we giver or taker, consumer or producer, because we want to, our reasons for wanting to may be different, but since it is a free choice, you are free to leave at any time, as well as you are free to say what you want to whom you want.
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Post by Tyne » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:32 pm

"Saying it is the porter's responsibility to make all mods work oversteps boundries"
I disagree, most mods would work easily and completely correctly on RADQuake if they took not even a day to fix the tiny mistakes they've made during the porting process - instead they act like nothing's wrong with it and if you point out any flaws then your ignored, treated like a piece of garbage, and hated so don't even bother. It's not my fault that Corporal steps on top of things he shouldn't be because Ian Micheal made a physics change because he doesn't know what he's doing and then blames my mod for similar cases like that.

Mods targetted for PC Quake are different yes and do not apply as much to this situation - still because of some blind changes in RADQuake mods that could work properly on it, do not, and once again with a tiny fix they could. Prydon Gate or any mods that print too many centerprint lines down the screen crash RADQuake because of a poor decision in what resolution speud made it use, is it the modders responsibility to go back and change over 1000 lines code (in Prydon Gates case) to fix the centerprint when Ian or speud could of just changed a couple of lines resulting in a 240y resolution and the mod would work fine?

NxQuake will stomp RADQuake (Really Annoying Developer Quake) Final in the end, I can see it forecoming anyways and I fully support BlackAura, Metafox, and Fragger.
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Post by Quzar » Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:48 pm

Tyne wrote:
"Saying it is the porter's responsibility to make all mods work oversteps boundries"
I disagree, ... snip ...
You misunderstood me completely and continue to show that you do not understand how it works. Nobody has any responsibility to anyone else here, or anywhere else, in this type of thing. So even if they SHOULD do it (a point which I am staying away from), they have no responsility to do so.
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Post by WRAGGSTER » Wed Sep 01, 2004 6:28 pm

speud wrote:have fun, i wont waste my time in here anymore.
yipee :)

break out the champagne

everyone round my house for a party
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Post by Tyne » Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:06 pm

quzar wrote:
Tyne wrote:
"Saying it is the porter's responsibility to make all mods work oversteps boundries"
I disagree, ... snip ...
You misunderstood me completely and continue to show that you do not understand how it works. Nobody has any responsibility to anyone else here, or anywhere else, in this type of thing. So even if they SHOULD do it (a point which I am staying away from), they have no responsility to do so.
Oh I know how it works, engines that break compatibilty when they shouldn't have to are shunned by the Quake community and are no longer considered "Quake" really, go into #qc and ask about Tenebrae and everyone there will laugh. I've been in the Quake scene since the day it came out and have never left, so I know how it works more then most people including yourself.

I wouldn't of made such a big deal if Ian Micheal didn't start pointing fingers at modders and blaming us because our mods do not work on his flakey Quake engine. I know he doesn't have to change or fix it but he can atleast accept the fact that he messed up not me or any other modder.
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