Barack Obama becomes POTUS-elect

[Stormwatch]

I'd choose to spend 150 hours in jail rather than as a slave for the "fellow man".

[Christuserloeser]

"in exchange for", and "is not forced" are keywords here. - What makes you think that working as an employee is less slavery ?

[Stormwatch]

Obama will call on citizens of all ages to serve America, by setting a goal that all middle school and high school students do 50 hours of community service a year and by developing a plan so that all college students who conduct 100 hours of community service receive a universal and fully refundable tax credit ensuring that the first $4,000 of their college education is completely free.

50 hours NOT optional, or even rewarded.

If they forced me to paint your walls, you can be sure I'd come back later... to burn down the whole house.

And I sent my comment to that "Change" site:

Mr. Obama, I am not an american citizen, but I would like to state my opinion on your concept of "America Serves".

Its essential, unforgivable flaw is the part about making service compulsory for students. The idea is nothing short of dictatorial; it makes every person a slave, even if for a number of hours. It shocks and disgusts me that a democratically elected leader can ever suggest such an evil thing with a straight face.

I would take my child out of school, rather than let him serve against his will; if forced to serve, I would instead sabotage any service, and do my worst to be a hindrance the "fellow man" that I am supposed to help; and if all else fails, I would choose to go to jail rather than serve. Because no proud, decent, self-respecting man will allow himself to be made a slave, even for a minute.

Thus, my suggestion for this plan is: make service strictly voluntary, with financial incentives; or as an alternative penalty to petty delinquents; only then it has any value. Otherwise, what you propose is nothing but the rape of freedom, the much vaunted quality that is said to be the source of the greatness of your country.

Sincerely,
-- Rodrigo Girao

[Ex-Cyber]

I fail to see how "call on" and "setting a goal" imply that it's mandatory.

[Stormwatch]

When it comes to governments, "mandatory" is the rule.

[Quzar]

I fail to see how "call on" and "setting a goal" imply that it's mandatory.

Well, they way I read it was that they're setting a goal for it to be mandatory. I don't disagree with it though, and it already happens.

[Wagh]

When it comes to governments, "mandatory" is the rule.

50 hours a year is not much.

Even then our government has trouble enforcing no child left behind stuff.
No way we could make this mandatory.

[Lartrak]

When it comes to governments, "mandatory" is the rule.

You know what happens when you assume, right?

[Stormwatch]

If my assumptions are ever incorrect, probably the source material is badly written.

[Specially Cork]

Its essential, unforgivable flaw is the part about making service compulsory for students. The idea is nothing short of dictatorial; it makes every person a slave, even if for a number of hours. It shocks and disgusts me that a democratically elected leader can ever suggest such an evil thing with a straight face.

So because this is a government making you do something against your will...you're against it? I assume your view holds steady for everything from paying taxes, to traffic law compliance too? "Obama won't let me kill children with my car, he's the new Hitler!"

I would take my child out of school, rather than let him serve against his will

Good job. Fucking up somebody else's future because your values are more important. You're a real man!

if forced to serve, I would instead sabotage any service, and do my worst to be a hindrance the "fellow man" that I am supposed to help

Good job. Being a jerk because your values are more important. You're a real man!

and if all else fails, I would choose to go to jail rather than serve.

But sending you to jail would be such a waste of taxes for such a petty crime. Maybe they could punish you with community service instead?

Because no proud, decent, self-respecting man will allow himself to be made a slave, even for a minute.

No proud, decent, self-respecting man would force himself to be a hinderance to "fellow man" and deny his child an education because he doesn't agree with a piece of government policy. Obviously we have different definitions of words like "decent".

Besides, community service is education. Isn't that the whole point of it?

[Christuserloeser]

Welcome back to slavery, America!

Well, in my opinion, public education should be free for everyone, but at the same time:

Community service in exchange for public education makes sense.

- especially if it enables those to get the eduction that they otherwise could not afford. It is a step in the right direction.

[Stormwatch]

So because this is a government making you do something against your will...you're against it? I assume your view holds steady for everything from paying taxes, to traffic law compliance too? "Obama won't let me kill children with my car, he's the new Hitler!"

The government can tell me NOT to do something that harms another; or compel me to do something in certain specific emergency situations; otherwise, it better stay the fuck out of my life.

Good job. Fucking up somebody else's future because your values are more important. You're a real man!

Home schooling? Private tutoring? If anything, the kid would get better education than in most schools.

Good job. Being a jerk because your values are more important. You're a real man!

Let me quote Marx... These are my principles. And if you don't like them, I have others. (I meant Groucho Marx)

But sending you to jail would be such a waste of taxes for such a petty crime. Maybe they could punish you with community service instead?

Oh no! Infinite loop! *head a splodes*

Besides, community service is education. Isn't that the whole point of it?

It teaches that government owns you. That's a nasty, immoral thing to teach.

Well, in my opinion, public education should be free for everyone

In an ideal world, yeah, but actually, TANSTAAFL.

[Specially Cork]

It teaches that government owns you. That's a nasty, immoral thing to teach.

I completely disagree. I think it teaches you to care about your local community and environment.

Besides, I'd personally accept that a government does own me; I play by their rules and pay them taxes. My only real freedom is to choose which government that is, whether that be through elections, or changing countries, or whatever. This may seem "nasty" but it's the truth, and worth teaching.

[Stormwatch]

http://www.infowars.com/?p=5828

[Lartrak]

In the months ahead, we can expect “public service,” i.e., compulsory servitude, to be a mantelpiece of the Obama regime. It will be necessary because Obama will undoubtedly soon have no shortage of enemies — that is to say, people opposed to his policies — and a national Stasi framework, under the rubric of a “civilian national security force,” will be required to ferret out enemies of the state. In addition, “carbon criminals” will need to be identified and rounded up and shipped off to re-education and forced labor camps.

Anyway, in looking at articles related to this, the wording was changed on the government site. Originally, it said required, but then later it was changed to "set a goal".

[melancholy]

I'm not going to lie, if I had the option to knock out $4000 of my college bill just by doing community service (which I did anyway), I would be thrilled.

[Jeeba Jabba]

In related news, who else here thinks that Obama's speech was absolutely epic? Like the kind of speech people will constantly quote from 50 years from now?

I am not one for speeches, because I can see through the bullshit. But this one definitely got me pretty proud of what we've done. And yes, it will be quoted for years, like Lincoln's Gettysburg Address, MLK Jr's I Have A Dream, and Kennedy's inaugural address.

CONVENIENTLY YOU FORGET REAGAN'S "TEAR DOWN THIS WALL"

[pavelbure]

I'm not going to lie, if I had the option to knock out $4000 of my college bill just by doing community service (which I did anyway), I would be thrilled.

that's the thing. the option is fine. requirement is not. let's see if hussein goes through with this.

[Wagh]

http://www.infowars.com/?p=5828

Ive been posting comments on this one lol. I love reading alex jones cuz the guy is such an over the top freak its funny. The comments though. man. So much hatred. It's worse than reading fox news.


Also
Stormwatch... maybe the reason you don't understand the way education works over here is because you read trash like infowars.

[Ex-Cyber]

The comments though. man. So much hatred. It's worse than reading fox news.

The amount of crazy (and borderline literacy) on display there is staggering. Incidentally, it looks like an outpost of the so-called Patriot movement (i.e. the types of people who think that income taxes are unconstitutional because "the Sixteenth Amendment was never ratified" and that Waco and Ruby Ridge were unforgivable while Oklahoma City was just desserts).