Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by Orion_ » Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:15 am

The Kickstarter was about an RPG game, not an RPG Maker.
You build a really nice tool that only you can use for now, but you miss the game that people are waiting for, a nice game engine without content is useless.
People didn't pay you for a tool, they paid for a game.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by |darc| » Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:09 pm

Orion_ wrote:The Kickstarter was about an RPG game, not an RPG Maker.
You build a really nice tool that only you can use for now, but you miss the game that people are waiting for, a nice game engine without content is useless.
People didn't pay you for a tool, they paid for a game.
Well, to be fair, I did.

I have no idea of Falco's (or his team's) talents when it comes to writing a plot or making artwork, but the engine looked very nice, and the idea that it would be open for anyone to develop their own game made me plunk down the $500. Had it not been for that I'd likely have just gotten a deluxe copy of the game or something.

That being said, the game itself absolutely should be completed. But it's not the part I'm most looking forward to. When the engine is released, we have the potential for tons of people to make new DC titles based on this tech. And given how many projects have been created around hacking the Quake engine, or Beats of Rage mods, I think that'll be the case.
It's thinking...
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by GyroVorbis » Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:49 pm

Orion_ wrote:The Kickstarter was about an RPG game, not an RPG Maker.
You build a really nice tool that only you can use for now, but you miss the game that people are waiting for, a nice game engine without content is useless.
People didn't pay you for a tool, they paid for a game.
Actually, a very large amount paid for the tool and not the game. Once again, you are making an assumption without actually knowing the facts.

Darc is by no means a very insignificant minority in why he backed us. A pretty significant number of backers don't actually care about ES itself, which is something I also have to respect.
Orion_ wrote:a nice game engine without content is useless.
Orly? Almost like... that's what a game engine is.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by Orion_ » Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:21 am

GyroVorbis wrote:Actually, a very large amount paid for the tool and not the game. Once again, you are making an assumption without actually knowing the facts.
Well, I'm just looking at your Kickstarter page, how many people paid for the creation rewards ? about 1% of the total
|darc| wrote:
Orion_ wrote:The Kickstarter was about an RPG game, not an RPG Maker.
You build a really nice tool that only you can use for now, but you miss the game that people are waiting for, a nice game engine without content is useless.
People didn't pay you for a tool, they paid for a game.
Well, to be fair, I did.
I have no idea of Falco's (or his team's) talents when it comes to writing a plot or making artwork, but the engine looked very nice, and the idea that it would be open for anyone to develop their own game made me plunk down the $500. Had it not been for that I'd likely have just gotten a deluxe copy of the game or something.
4 people did, out of ... 2282
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by |darc| » Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:28 pm

Orion_ wrote:Well, I'm just looking at your Kickstarter page, how many people paid for the creation rewards ? about 1% of the total
4 people did, out of ... 2282
What does that have to do with your point re: funding it for the game or funding it for the toolkit?

The release of the toolkit doesn't have anything to do with the upper tier rewards...
It's thinking...
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by mankrip » Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:44 pm

GyroVorbis wrote:I have been working my ass off all day every day lately preparing for a big KS update
"Big" doesn't necessarily mean "relevant".
GyroVorbis wrote:We have a new guy doing PR to help out with the Kickstarter, and I changed the credentials from my own personal password to something for him, and now I can't remember, so I am locked out of KS
No comment.
GyroVorbis wrote:any impulsive emotional response I make out of people pissing on my work (which is a sign of low prefrontal cortex control over the amygdala, which is a tell-tale symptom of ADHD).
I see.
GyroVorbis wrote:This shit is the reason I'm on antidepressants
They don't seem to be working.



Also, I agree with what |darc| said here.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by mankrip » Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:53 pm

|darc| wrote:the engine looked very nice, and the idea that it would be open for anyone to develop their own game made me plunk down the $500. [...] When the engine is released, we have the potential for tons of people to make new DC titles based on this tech.
That's also why I backed it, but nowadays I wouldn't use ESTK anymore.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by GyroVorbis » Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:10 pm

Orion_ wrote:
GyroVorbis wrote:Actually, a very large amount paid for the tool and not the game. Once again, you are making an assumption without actually knowing the facts.
Well, I'm just looking at your Kickstarter page, how many people paid for the creation rewards ? about 1% of the total
|darc| wrote:
Orion_ wrote:The Kickstarter was about an RPG game, not an RPG Maker.
You build a really nice tool that only you can use for now, but you miss the game that people are waiting for, a nice game engine without content is useless.
People didn't pay you for a tool, they paid for a game.
Well, to be fair, I did.
I have no idea of Falco's (or his team's) talents when it comes to writing a plot or making artwork, but the engine looked very nice, and the idea that it would be open for anyone to develop their own game made me plunk down the $500. Had it not been for that I'd likely have just gotten a deluxe copy of the game or something.
4 people did, out of ... 2282
Yeaaaaaah... uh... like darc said, what does that have to do with anything? You do know that anyone who paid $15 for the base game also gets ESTk, right? :lol:
mankrip wrote:
GyroVorbis wrote:I have been working my ass off all day every day lately preparing for a big KS update
"Big" doesn't necessarily mean "relevant".
...Are you seriously like... complaining about the quality of a KS update I haven't even made yet? :roll:

Yeah uh, I see you're unhappy guys, but at this point, this is pretty much becoming ridiculous. You are looking for things to complain about that aren't even real... Let's be honest here. Why am I getting 10000x more shit lately now that there is more content and more progress being made than the rest of the year put together? Are you really pissed off about the game, or is something else going on here?

If you just hate me, that's cool, but if it's something more, help my socially retarded ass understand, please. The only thing I can think of is that you're mad that updates and content were coming out on social media before they came to KS, which in retrospect makes quite a bit of sense to me, as you guys are the ones who paid to make this happen... Would me doing something like giving you guys personal video updates every so often and let you see things before everyone else and before the rest of the content goes public help to fix that? Assuming that's even the real issue here... I can totally understand that, but nobody has articulated that at all so far... or hey, maybe you can rightfully argue it isn't your job to do that? Fine. Is this the real problem?

If I'm not starting to get real feedback here anymore, then when I don't respond to this in a timely manner, you can't all freak out and pretend that I'm running off like some kind of a pussy... I literally have Qt Creator open right now, working on code, but I know I have to come respond here or people are going to freak out. This is eating into development time. I have no problem coming back and being your personal punching bag after more content is posted, but after the initial stream of things to bitch about has been exhausted and it deteriorates to personal insults and making up issues, it's no longer in either of our best interest that I linger around here.
mankrip wrote:
GyroVorbis wrote:This shit is the reason I'm on antidepressants
They don't seem to be working.
Yeaaaaah, I wake up every day stoked as fuck to work on ES despite all of the toxicity and negativity I get from you guys... we're going to have to agree to disagree here. :lol:
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by mankrip » Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:01 pm

GyroVorbis wrote:
mankrip wrote:"Big" doesn't necessarily mean "relevant".
...Are you seriously like... complaining about the quality of a KS update I haven't even made yet? :roll:

Yeah uh, I see you're unhappy guys, but at this point, this is pretty much becoming ridiculous. You are looking for things to complain about that aren't even real... Let's be honest here. Why am I getting 10000x more shit lately now that there is more content and more progress being made than the rest of the year put together? Are you really pissed off about the game, or is something else going on here?

If you just hate me, that's cool, but if it's something more, help my socially retarded ass understand, please. The only thing I can think of is that you're mad that updates and content were coming out on social media before they came to KS, which in retrospect makes quite a bit of sense to me, as you guys are the ones who paid to make this happen... Would me doing something like giving you guys personal video updates every so often and let you see things before everyone else and before the rest of the content goes public help to fix that? Assuming that's even the real issue here... I can totally understand that, but nobody has articulated that at all so far... or hey, maybe you can rightfully argue it isn't your job to do that? Fine. Is this the real problem?

If I'm not starting to get real feedback here anymore, then when I don't respond to this in a timely manner, you can't all freak out and pretend that I'm running off like some kind of a pussy... I literally have Qt Creator open right now, working on code, but I know I have to come respond here or people are going to freak out. This is eating into development time. I have no problem coming back and being your personal punching bag after more content is posted, but after the initial stream of things to bitch about has been exhausted and it deteriorates to personal insults and making up issues, it's no longer in either of our best interest that I linger around here.
A huge four-paragraph reply to a 5-word statement.

Being assertive is not incompatible with being concise.

I'm reading everything out of respect, but I'm not going to feed walls of text.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by GyroVorbis » Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:40 pm

Uh, dude, I responded to your 5-word statement with a single sentence. That following paragraphs were not a response to that sentence...

Are you seriously just going to ignore the part where I'm trying to ask you what you want me to do to make you happy as a backer? Because that's the entire next paragraph... I was respectfully asking for an honest opinion. I don't have the will to fight with you guys anymore. Project is going well, team is in high spirits, I'm happy with the progress we're making for the first time in forever, and I would just like to get past this, so we can make a badass game together.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by GyroVorbis » Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:48 pm

If you guys want to get on Skype, Discord, or anything with file transfers, I have some screen recordings of some new gameplay and menu stuff if you want to see it, but it's still WIP, so I wasn't wanting to just release it to the general public or pop it on YouTube yet.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by Nico0020 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:45 pm

Here is what I think would help many of your backers have some faith in this project again. No one here wants personal updates or preferential treatment. We want you to handle this project responsibly, and to be respectful to all those who gave you over $185,000 of their money.

A KICKSTARTER update which addresses the project as a whole. I will preface by saying you should NOT post a wall of colorful speeches, diatribes, or long stories blaming others. Clear the table on what happened, what is happening, what will happen and won’t happen. These points would be a good start.

1. Who are the current members of the team now?
How long have they been working on the project, and what are their jobs?

2. What sort of timeline/schedule have you and the team set for yourselves?
What you are working on, and when you want it done by.
What do you still need to do, and when do you want it done by.
What deadline have you set for yourself to getting the game to your backers?

3. Do you have any gameplay experiences finished? Or is just tech?
Even just one fully functioning town / dungeon / quest?

4. With the money all gone, how do you plan to release the game (if ever finished) to your backers?
What about your deal with watermelon, physical and collectors editions?
Other misc items like guidebook and DVD boxsets. How will you produce these now?

5. What happened to the digital notebooks for your backers that you posted in your last KS update?

6. Who will be handling updates and communication with your backers from this point on?

7. How are you correcting the mistakes you have made with the project and past team members, in order to not have them again?
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by mankrip » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:37 pm

GyroVorbis wrote:I'm trying to ask you what you want me to do to make you happy as a backer
Honestly, not much. Even if the game is released exactly as you promised, it's hard for me to imagine myself having fun while playing it anymore.

it's a disappointment to wait for news about the game and end up reading drama. Lots and lots of overly dramatic statements. Extracting the bits about how the game is actually progressing is a boring experience that gets progressively more sad with the disappointment of each outburst of drama.

An overly emotional attitude works well for hyping things, but not for discussing issues.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by GyroVorbis » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:03 am

Nico0020 wrote:Here is what I think would help many of your backers have some faith in this project again. No one here wants personal updates or preferential treatment. We want you to handle this project responsibly, and to be respectful to all those who gave you over $185,000 of their money.

A KICKSTARTER update which addresses the project as a whole. I will preface by saying you should NOT post a wall of colorful speeches, diatribes, or long stories blaming others. Clear the table on what happened, what is happening, what will happen and won’t happen. These points would be a good start.

1. Who are the current members of the team now?
How long have they been working on the project, and what are their jobs?

2. What sort of timeline/schedule have you and the team set for yourselves?
What you are working on, and when you want it done by.
What do you still need to do, and when do you want it done by.
What deadline have you set for yourself to getting the game to your backers?

3. Do you have any gameplay experiences finished? Or is just tech?
Even just one fully functioning town / dungeon / quest?

4. With the money all gone, how do you plan to release the game (if ever finished) to your backers?
What about your deal with watermelon, physical and collectors editions?
Other misc items like guidebook and DVD boxsets. How will you produce these now?

5. What happened to the digital notebooks for your backers that you posted in your last KS update?

6. Who will be handling updates and communication with your backers from this point on?

7. How are you correcting the mistakes you have made with the project and past team members, in order to not have them again?
Well shit. I very much appreciate you taking the time to post this. Great feedback. I will absolutely answer all of these with the post. Thank you.

Edit: Check your Facebook, I PMed you asking for your feedback on the dev notebooks.
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by ConnorORT » Sat Apr 21, 2018 5:55 pm

Hi all, I have a message for all who backed the Elysian Shadows Kickstarter campaign. Please read, thanks!
Dear Elysian Shadows Kickstarter backers.

My name is Connor Linning and back in 2014 I was contributing soundtrack work to the kickstarted game Elysian Shadows. While this should have been a happy time, the unfortunate reality is that the situation had soured to the point where I (and the majority of other people who worked on the project) felt the only option moving forward was to leave the project.

I am posting this open letter to you because I would like to try and make up for that disappointment. After leaving Elysian Shadows I developed three small free games and a couple of soundtracks for other games. For the last two years I’ve been working on my 2D RPG Towards The Pantheon which releases on May 16th. Former Elysian Shadows pixel artist Leandro Tokarveski created all of the pixel art for Towards The Pantheon and other former Elysian Shadows members such as Daniel Tindall also contributed to the game.

I am offering a free Steam key and free Bandcamp soundtrack key to all backers of Elysian Shadows. This offer is for all backers regardless of the amount of money pledged to the Elysian Shadows Kickstarter campaign. The game is roughly 10 hours long and the soundtrack consists of over 2.5 hours of music. It is important to me that anyone who has supported me knows that I work hard to deliver the best results I can for them. While obviously this is neither the game nor soundtrack you pledged for, I am offering this in gratitude of your support of my work and to show that I never took your support for granted.

To receive your free keys after the launch of the game on May 16th, send an e-mail to backerkeys@connorlinning.com using the same e-mail address associated with your Kickstarter account and include in the body the name associated with the Kickstarter account. You must include your name and use the same e-mail address so that I can verify you as a backer using the public community page on the Elysian Shadows Kickstarter page. After May 16th I will reply with your keys as quickly as possible. Unfortunately, I cannot offer this to those who preordered copies of the game while I was on the team as that data belongs to the Elysian Shadows team.

Please note that I never accepted any funds from the Elysian Shadows Kickstarter and that Towards The Pantheon was completely self-funded. Towards The Pantheon is in no way associated with Elysian Shadows. I do not intend to speak on behalf of, or represent, the Elysian Shadows company, team, or project in any way with this open letter. Pursuing other projects did not factor into my leaving the Elysian Shadows team. None of us left Elysian Shadows project with the intention of creating something new together - there was a span of over a year and a half between my leaving of Elysian Shadows and the beginning of Towards The Pantheon’s development. Since we have remained friends, it made sense to later work together again. I hope that I am clear in stating that there are no malicious intentions associated with this open letter and have no desire to rehash any past concerns with the current Elysian Shadows team. That would take away time and attention that is better focused on game development - which at the end of the day is what should really matter. I will be posting this open letter and contacting a few game journalists so that my offer can reach as many backers as possible as I do not access to the list of backer e-mail addresses.

I agree with businessman Gary Vaynerchuk that there are two ways to try and succeed; through hard work and positivity, or by tearing everyone else down and winning by default. I am in music and game development for the long haul and only want to succeed if it’s through hard work and positivity. We have limited time in life and I don’t want to spend any of it on pointless drama and negativity. This is why I have not publicly taken part in any drama regarding Elysian Shadows. I hope that the remaining Elysian Shadows members work hard and make a great game that ultimately delivers the vision promised to you, the backer. I still thank the team for the opportunity I had to work with them and wish them the best.

Thanks again to all Elysian Shadows Kickstarter backers for the incredible support you showed back in 2014. - Connor Linning
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Re: Elysian Shadows Kickstarter Live NOW!

Post by mankrip » Wed Apr 25, 2018 3:10 pm

ConnorORT wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 5:55 pm
I am posting this open letter to you because I would like to try and make up for that disappointment. [...] For the last two years I’ve been working on my 2D RPG Towards The Pantheon which releases on May 16th. Former Elysian Shadows pixel artist Leandro Tokarveski created all of the pixel art for Towards The Pantheon and other former Elysian Shadows members such as Daniel Tindall also contributed to the game.

I am offering a free Steam key and free Bandcamp soundtrack key to all backers of Elysian Shadows. [...] While obviously this is neither the game nor soundtrack you pledged for, I am offering this in gratitude of your support of my work and to show that I never took your support for granted.
I backed a game, you're delivering a game. That's fair enough given the circumstances, and it's the best news since the Kickstarter campaign ended.
ConnorORT wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 5:55 pm
Please note that I never accepted any funds from the Elysian Shadows Kickstarter [...].
That's news for me.
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